General > Discussion

Dual Wielding Pistols?

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sirg:
Tbh I don't like much the idea of dual pistols, but I don't want this feature removed.

However, a professional soldier part of an elite organization will probably never dual wield pistols. That's cool if you make a game with cowboys and outlaws, or maybe gangsters. It's a cool thing you see in action movies.
A professional soldier will always preffer the accuracy of a single pistol instead of twice the damage but inaccurate. You can't really aim using 2 pistols, unless you have 2 independent heads or something :)

Surrealistik:

--- Quote ---Talking specifically about the laser pistol, you still wouldn't be able to see where you were aiming the infrared laser beam without looking through the pistol scope or other vision enhancer. Aiki-Knight is entirely correct -- the lack of recoil doesn't compensate for the fact that you'll have accuracy considerably lower than an ordinary handgun of any variety due to lack of line-of-sight aiming and lack of a two-handed grip, accuracy which is already pretty poor due to you firing a handgun and not a rifle. And now you're now using two hands to fire two handguns suboptimally when you could be using them to fire a laser rifle optimally, thereby eliminating the only battlefield advantage pistols have over rifles, which is that they can be fired one-handed.
--- End quote ---

According to the game mechanics he is not, unless there is a tremendous degredation of accuracy; the firepower provided by two simutaneously firing laser pistols is superior to that of one laser rifle. That said, despite the lack of perfect LoS aiming, at least passable accuracy should be possible by aligning the two pistols simutaneously in front of one's eyes. I've used light guns at range in this manner (roughly typical of average engagement ranges in urban combat), and while my ability to hit especially small targets was not the best, man sized targets were typically not a problem.

Aiki-Knight:
Yes, there's no need to remove the feature; I just humbly suggest that two-handed firing is usually more trouble than help. Even if a sidearm were truly one-hand-only operated, it's just not accurate to shoot them together. Yes, you could shoot two at once, and a decent shooter could hit a target, but really, even an expert shooter wouldn't. Yes, this game has close-quarters combat, but most police shootouts occur within 7 meters. That's right, 7 meters. Close enough to qualify as close combat? Yet no police officer wields two weapons simultaneously, because it's already hard enough to win close-quarters shootouts with the accuracy bonus of a single, eye-level aimed sidearm in the hands of a well-trained police officer (I've never heard of special forces dual-wielding sidearms, either. I'm no expert on special forces, but can anyone substantiate otherwise?). After all, it's not who fires the most shots, but rather who brings rounds on target the quickest. One well-placed shot to the centre of body mass or between the eyes is going to win over a hail of bullets roughly on target (if even that), especially against enemies who are heavily armored.

The only application I think think of for wielding dual pistols is when no larger weapons (or ammo) are available, and one needs to lay down cover fire at short range. Otherwise, a single rifle in infinitely superior to dual pistols. More power, and just WAY more accuracy.

Of course, we're forgetting this: how many truly ambidextrous shooters are there out there? Should special forces operators spend all their time honing their dual-pistol-wielding skills just in case? Most shooters are side-biased. I'm a right-hand shooter. Could I do it left-side? Maybe. Do it well, in the stress of close-quarters combat? I seriously doubt it. No, actually, I know I couldn't.

Surrealistik:

--- Quote ---Yes, there's no need to remove the feature; I just humbly suggest that two-handed firing is usually more trouble than help. Even if a sidearm were truly one-hand-only operated, it's just not accurate to shoot them together. Yes, you could shoot two at once, and a decent shooter could hit a target, but really, even an expert shooter wouldn't. Yes, this game has close-quarters combat, but most police shootouts occur within 7 meters. That's right, 7 meters. Close enough to qualify as close combat? Yet no police officer wields two weapons simultaneously, because it's already hard enough to win close-quarters shootouts with the accuracy bonus of a single, eye-level aimed sidearm in the hands of a well-trained police officer (I've never heard of special forces dual-wielding sidearms, either. I'm no expert on special forces, but can anyone substantiate otherwise?). After all, it's not who fires the most shots, but rather who brings rounds on target the quickest. One well-placed shot to the centre of body mass or between the eyes is going to win over a hail of bullets roughly on target (if even that), especially against enemies who are heavily armored.
--- End quote ---

I completely agree with you in so far as weapons with signifigant recoil are concerned, but in the absence of that, dual wielding with appreciable accuracy, and thus plausibility, becomes possible.



--- Quote ---The only application I think think of for wielding dual pistols is when no larger weapons (or ammo) are available, and one needs to lay down cover fire at short range. Otherwise, a single rifle in infinitely superior to dual pistols. More power, and just WAY more accuracy.
--- End quote ---


Specifically concerning dual laser pistols versus a single laser rifle, the former features a lot more firepower. While the accuracy of dual wielded laser pistols is clearly inferior to that of a single laser rifle this discrepancy would not be such that dual wielding would not have a situational use for close quarters/urban combat.

Winter:

--- Quote from: Surrealistik on July 02, 2008, 09:00:30 pm ---According to the game mechanics he is not, unless there is a tremendous degredation of accuracy; the firepower provided by two simutaneously firing laser pistols is superior to that of one laser rifle. That said, despite the lack of perfect LoS aiming, at least passable accuracy should be possible by aligning the two pistols simutaneously in front of one's eyes. I've used light guns at range in this manner (roughly typical of average engagement ranges in urban combat), and while my ability to hit especially small targets was not the best, man sized targets were typically not a problem.

--- End quote ---

Then that's nothing more than a balancing error and the weapons in question need to be reworked to make the rifle appreciably superior to dual pistols.

Regards,
Winter

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