Base attack soldiers placement

[CheeseshireCat]

First, to make it clear. Yes, I saw all the arguments regarding to soldier placements. They aren't worth <censored>. THIS *IS* A *MAJOR* BUG.

Come on, you have a couple hours advance warning of an UFO approaching the base, and all the soldiers are in their bunks (or even Hell knows where)? Not at their battle stations?

I just had a mission where my soldiers were split into two groups of four, one group being FIVE(!) full-move turns away from the entrance, another being NINE full-move turns away. Oh, and that's on a base where I have barracks right next to the entrance just to try and prevent exactly that sort of idiocy. If anything, the spawn spots on base map should get changed to place soldiers at the entrance, and aliens having to approach it from afar (likely, over the easily defensible terrain, like those 5 turns of move against sniper towers -- though with the messed up cover being more effective against the unit hiding in cover than one shooting at it, that won't work, either).

As is, it is more like us assaulting an alien-occupied base...

[geever]

First, to make it clear. Yes, I saw all the arguments regarding to soldier placements. They aren't worth <censored>. THIS *IS* A *MAJOR* BUG.

There is no bug there.

-geever

[CheeseshireCat]

Bug by design *is* still a bug.

[H-Hour]

Bug by design *is* still a bug.

First, I think you miss the point. A bug is when something does not work as intended. If it works as intended, even if you don't like the way it was intended to work, it's not a bug.

Second, how do you think your suggestion would improve the game? As I see it, it would only make base attacks easier, make base attacks more repetitive (always encountering them from the same place), and reduce the risks associated with a base attack.

[killyblame]

hello guys, as he said, it really doesnt make sense, at second, its not like defending the base is difficult atm, i have already done it atleast 100 times, all u need is 2 soldiers, if the base has more entrances, u got to defend the command center instead of the stairs, the base with antimatter storage needs more soldiers atleast 3

[CheeseshireCat]

First, I think you miss the point. A bug is when something does not work as intended. If it works as intended, even if you don't like the way it was intended to work, it's not a bug.

Ahem. If someone's missing anything here, it's not me. Repeat. Bug. By. Design. Is. Still. A. Bug.

Second, how do you think your suggestion would improve the game? As I see it, it would only make base attacks easier, make base attacks more repetitive (always encountering them from the same place), and reduce the risks associated with a base attack.

Well, for one, it would make the base defense mission less idiotic.
Second, it would make it less frustrating. (I.e., you won't have to spend half an hour just to get to action).
Three, it would make it that easy only against dumb as doorknob lightly armed aliens. Against a wave of even 4-5, sniper towers would do little but attract fire.

Now, ask the same question about the current state. How does it *improve* the game? Well, drop the "how" from there first.

1) It doesn't make base attacks any more difficult (Right now, all you need is just stand guard behind a corner with a flamethrower, is all).
2) It makes base attacks even more repetitive (you still do it from the same place, the entrance, the only difference is just *getting there*).

If you want a suggestion how to improve it... Unlock the access points. As of now, aliens can get in only via the large hangar (one-way) and the entrance. There are at least three other building types which [should] have surface entrances, even if locked.

And repeat: as of now, base attacks are as repetitive as they could be. With legwork attached... It's THE most tedious (not hard) mission. (Second place is Big City, for the similar reason).

Again, tedious != hard nor difficult.

[CheeseshireCat]

Oh, and another point... Is the point making it most difficult possible? Well, why not start off the very first mission with aliens having best equipment and best armor?

[H-Hour]

Well, for one, it would make the base defense mission less idiotic.
Second, it would make it less frustrating. (I.e., you won't have to spend half an hour just to get to action).
Three, it would make it that easy only against dumb as doorknob lightly armed aliens. Against a wave of even 4-5, sniper towers would do little but attract fire.

1. Disagree. Your sense of "realism" about where soldiers would be and how the aliens would approach the base leaves much to be desired. Aliens would not walk up to an entrance. They'd be more likely to blow it open and drop down quickly. And putting soldiers "on alert" every time a UFO is within radar range would be exhausting for such a small team.

2. I don't think it takes 30 minutes to move four turns.

3. This does not appear to be a suggested improvement. And all of our aliens are dumb as doorknob. That's the only brand of AI we have.

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So what you're asking is for an entirely new map to be created in which the player soldiers sit behind defensive positions and shoot at approaching aliens. If you'd like to, go ahead and create it. I'll even help you work out how to provide a modified .ufo file that others can download to use your base defense map instead of ours. But why would I want to put in so much time and effort on completely changing base defense missions for no real improvement in the game?

[CheeseshireCat]

1. Disagree. Your sense of "realism" about where soldiers would be and how the aliens would approach the base leaves much to be desired. Aliens would not walk up to an entrance. They'd be more likely to blow it open and drop down quickly. And putting soldiers "on alert" every time a UFO is within radar range would be exhausting for such a small team.

Well, since they DON'T blow holes up, it's normal to defent the *possible* points of entry. Other than that... Any military base is defended all of the time. And even if you insist that "realism" is everyone sleeping until alerted... AND that getting on alert when the threat is high and real (it's wartime, guys), make it not "withing radar range", but an UFO withing 10 minutes of flight time to the base and heading in its direction.

2. I don't think it takes 30 minutes to move four turns.

For, no. Nine, yes. But ahem... With the overblown hyperboles you just used yourself, nitpicking on whether it's 30 or 26 minutes is *really* missing the point.

3. This does not appear to be a suggested improvement. And all of our aliens are dumb as doorknob. That's the only brand of AI we have.

There was another point that you /decided/ to skip there. Underarmed. Make sure the base attack missions have good ones (above average skills, good equipment). Maximum numbers, too.

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So what you're asking is for an entirely new map to be created in which the player soldiers sit behind defensive positions and shoot at approaching aliens. If you'd like to, go ahead and create it. I'll even help you work out how to provide a modified .ufo file that others can download to use your base defense map instead of ours. But why would I want to put in so much time and effort on completely changing base defense missions for no real improvement in the game?

I don't say a completely different map. I said, place soldier spawn points close to entrances, not Hell knows where. And well, I'd do it already if I had an idea how to operate that editor.

... But frankly, you calling military base in war time being defended being "much to be desired" in terms of realism makes me think you *live* in a chessboard world...

[killyblame]

to be honest u can fix it yourself, just build all the canteens near the entrances = problem solved

[CheeseshireCat]

Not to mention it's missing the point, I had it built that way, then had to build one more to accomodate for more tech people. Since then, at least four soldiers are always spawned in that furthest one. Also, I often have soldiers spawn in either a command center or a lab.

[Pheimors]

Well, since they DON'T blow holes up, it's normal to defent the *possible* points of entry. Other than that... Any military base is defended all of the time. And even if you insist that "realism" is everyone sleeping until alerted... AND that getting on alert when the threat is high and real (it's wartime, guys), make it not "withing radar range", but an UFO withing 10 minutes of flight time to the base and heading in its direction.

Yep, but if you are looking for realism, don't forget that aliens doesn't exists. So military bases are not to be defended against aliens...