Non-Anthropomorphic Taman, Shgaar and Ortnok?

[Flying Steel]

"Humanoid" aliens are kind of cheesy looking and not especially realistic, at least when you have more than one (in this case three) from entirely different origins, imo. I thought I saw one of the lead devs say something to a similar effect a ways back while lurking on these forums.

So my question for those in charge is, would you prefer content representing truly alien but practical morphologies over greys, dinosaur men and space orks if the content was available to you?

[BTAxis]

I think that's hard. Any "normal" alien unit has to be able to carry and use the alien weaponry, and any model has to fit in the 1x1 box. That limits the amount of alien-ness you can put in. Plus, humanoid shapes have the advantage that existing animations can be used for them, and animations are even harder to come by than models.

And, well, we already have UFOPaedia articles and autopsy images for the existing aliens, so we're probably not going to replace them in any event.

[Flying Steel]

I think that's hard. Any "normal" alien unit has to be able to carry and use the alien weaponry, and any model has to fit in the 1x1 box. That limits the amount of alien-ness you can put in.

True that grasping and wielding weapons requires either hands or tentacles, but there's still things you can do with those for some variations.

Fitting aliens into a 1x1x1 box isn't hard, the blood spider is already an example of this. Fitting them in a 1x1x2 can be done using a number of nonhumanoid but upright forms. Like a mantis form, bird/dinosaur form, cobra/hydralisk form, a floater-with-hanging tentacles jellyfish (or zerg overlord) form, etc.

The shagar (or whatever it's called) is almost an example of this, and its tail looks like it even might violate the 1x1 boundary a bit.

Plus, humanoid shapes have the advantage that existing animations can be used for them, and animations are even harder to come by than models.

And, well, we already have UFOPaedia articles and autopsy images for the existing aliens, so we're probably not going to replace them in any event.

That's why I ask this with the assumption that you are provided full content of similar or superior technical quality, for each replaced design- model, textures, animations and research depictions. (The UFOpedia articles would remain the same for every sentence not including words like "humanoid" or "anthropomorphic").

I want to know if you folks would be game for something like this, if content availability/quality was not an issue and the designs fit as well as or better your theme of 'realistic sci-fi-horror'?

[BTAxis]

I want to know if you folks would be game for something like this, if content availability/quality was not an issue and the designs fit as well as or better your theme of 'realistic sci-fi-horror'?

In principle yes, though we'll probably want to retain the Taman especially because of its similarities to the "grey" type alien.

[BTAxis]

Oh, also, most normal aliens should come in unarmoured and armoured varieties. Not all of them need apply though (a floating alien wouldn't need a jump armour). There will be such a thing as inherent armour, so for the singleplayer balancing it is not such a big deal, but the player is going to have to get the alien armours from somewhere, and there is also multiplayer to consider.

[H-Hour]

Yeah, I think any new aliens are likely to be added to rather than replace the current aliens. But they'd probably be welcome. If you can do modeling/artwork, we could really use the help.

See this post for an interesting alien in progress that I'm hoping Skopio will animate.

[Flying Steel]

Armor variants shouldn't be a big problem.

In principle yes, though we'll probably want to retain the Taman especially because of its similarities to the "grey" type alien.

The new head looks great, but I think it may be a little too close to the standard grey/sectoid design for comfort. We really want to maintain a non-standard look for everything in UFO:AI.

I'm getting some conflicting signals on this aspect of the art direction, it seems like. Have you folks in the design team not fully agreed on the desired direction of the Taman?

Yeah, I think any new aliens are likely to be added to rather than replace the current aliens. But they'd probably be welcome. If you can do modeling/artwork, we could really use the help.

I'm thinking of doing a little of both actually. Methinks it would be an important enhancement to the feel of the game, to have both a fairly large number of and truly alien variation in the creatures showing up over the course of the game. Three "spacemen" type aliens just don't come anywhere near the full potential of this aspect of the game, which is something I'd like to fix if possible.

[H-Hour]

I'm getting some conflicting signals on this aspect of the art direction, it seems like. Have you folks in the design team not fully agreed on the desired direction of the Taman?

I think that's generally accurate.

Three "spacemen" type aliens just don't come anywhere near the full potential of this aspect of the game, which is something I'd like to fix if possible.

Adding rather than replacing is a good place to start. Like I said, the game really needs more artists for precisely the kinds of additions you're suggesting.

[BTAxis]

I'm getting some conflicting signals on this aspect of the art direction, it seems like. Have you folks in the design team not fully agreed on the desired direction of the Taman?

The Taman is supposed to resemble a grey. Other aliens are not.

[Flying Steel]

Adding rather than replacing is a good place to start. Like I said, the game really needs more artists for precisely the kinds of additions you're suggesting.

There's some other art assets I'd like to add before I get to this anyway. I'm thinking more in terms of a pre-2.4 timeline.

Plus, in attempting to replace the shagaar and ortnok there could be versions that don't make one of those two parts, but instead becomes the content that represents additional alien species.

[Winter]

I think that's generally accurate.

Not so. As I said, we want a nonstandard look -- that means we want to keep the Taman, but we don't it to look exactly the bloody same as the X-COM sectoid, which the submitted head from that thread did.

Regards,
Winter

[Flying Steel]

Would you folks mind if the Tamans' legs were digitigrade?

Realistically speaking, it would probably make them faster runners than humans, but slower swimmers.

[BTAxis]

The Tamans are supposed to be comparatively weak, physiologically inferior to humans but with a superior mental capacity. So they'd be relatively easy to deal with at the start of the game, but then they'd become a threat again once the aliens started to use psi.

[H-Hour]

Not so. As I said, we want a nonstandard look -- that means we want to keep the Taman, but we don't it to look exactly the bloody same as the X-COM sectoid, which the submitted head from that thread did.

I was speaking more generally. And I still think that it is generally accurate that there is no artistic direction from the devs. There is only you and BTAxis coming in after the fact saying yes or, more often, no.

[Flying Steel]

I was speaking more generally. And I still think that it is generally accurate that there is no artistic direction from the devs. There is only you and BTAxis coming in after the fact saying yes or, more often, no.

This is true, to really be able to attract and manage the art contributions you are requesting, it is important to have all of your concepts' requirements written down ahead of time and accessible to artists. For existing content that you wouldn't mind having replaced or improved at some point in the future, it is very helpful to list the features that you want to keep and the things you would like to see changed and how.