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Author Topic: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...  (Read 9492 times)

Offline DiDiT

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2010, 03:42:43 pm »
Lasers, for example, could also be adapted as projectile propulsion, especially in combination with another, like plasma or EM propulsion. Plasma can be used for engines, too, if EM focusing like the one in PB weapons is used. Perhaps later in game, this could become a new type of propulsion, striking middle ground between speed of AM engines and fuel availability of jet engines.

wait, what? lasers as propulsion? wouldn't they just burn though the round?
on the other hand, EM and plasma might work well together.

oh, and the plasma engines idea sound good.

Offline Sarin

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2010, 05:08:28 pm »
Not exactly. Some time ago, I've read about experiments with this kind of propulsion, just used in larger scale to Earth-orbit transport. Basically, laser is used to heat up the air (via some infra-absorbing material) in the cavity in the back of the projectile, creating a kind of "rocket engine". This has several advantages. Less recoil, as the projectile continues to accelerate when out of barell, more stable flight trajectory...it probably won't be an automatic weapon, but a heavy sniper weapon or a new kind of rocket launcher.

Offline DiDiT

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2010, 05:29:59 pm »
ah.  ;D i thought you meant something like that.

yeah, i like the idea. a bigger sniper rifle that isn't the bolt gun would be nice.

Offline Sgt. Hatter

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2010, 05:55:36 pm »
a bigger sniper rifle that isn't the bolt gun would be nice.

What about the Coilgun?

Offline DiDiT

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #19 on: March 07, 2010, 05:57:23 pm »
coil-gun? *facepalm* ah, freck... I knew there were still some weapons I hadn't tried yet!

Offline Sarin

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2010, 06:18:46 pm »
When I think of it...could be like this:

Name: Laser Artillery

Long range support weapon. Built upon upscaled heavy laser, this weapon can deliver specially developed HEAP or HEI 30 mm shells over long distance with high accuracy, serving as field artillery as well as another kind of "sniper". Not much improvement over HPML in damage, but laser propulsion allows semi-automatic operation, and holographic targeting increases accuracy. Its greatest disadvatage is that, after certain distance is travelled, laser loses contact with projectile, resulting in high gravity drop after certain point, limiting maximum range.

Since standard DF cartridges won't be sufficent to power this laser, each ammo pack contains a larger DF pack.

Stats:

Damage type-explosive
damage: 135 HEAP, 110 HEI
accuracy: 0.7 aimed shot, 1 for 3-round burst.
Range: 120
Clip size: 3
TU cost: Aimed shot 19, burst 28.


Offline Sgt. Hatter

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2010, 06:27:39 pm »
coil-gun? *facepalm* ah, freck... I knew there were still some weapons I hadn't tried yet!

It's not in 2.2.1, but in 2.3, the coilgun is a researchable sniper weapon, based off the electromagnetic rifle (AKA Bolter), and alien Needler weapons.  It's ammo capacity blows immense chunks (only 2 shots per clip, and the clips are 2x2 objects), but it does a ridiculous amount of damage over stupefyingly long range, without the inaccuracy issues of the bolter.

Like the UFOpaedia entry says, "we basically scaled down a tank's main gun."

Name: Laser Artillery

Long range support weapon. Built upon upscaled heavy laser, this weapon can deliver specially developed HEAP or HEI 30 mm shells over long distance with high accuracy, serving as field artillery as well as another kind of "sniper". Not much improvement over HPML in damage, but laser propulsion allows semi-automatic operation, and holographic targeting increases accuracy. Its greatest disadvatage is that, after certain distance is travelled, laser loses contact with projectile, resulting in high gravity drop after certain point, limiting maximum range.

Since standard DF cartridges won't be sufficent to power this laser, each ammo pack contains a larger DF pack.

Stats:

Damage type-explosive
damage: 135 HEAP, 110 HEI
accuracy: 0.7 aimed shot, 1 for 3-round burst.
Range: 120
Clip size: 3
TU cost: Aimed shot 19, burst 28.

I'm kinda leery of this weapon, mainly because of the TU cost.  If I'm reading you right, it does a total of 245 damage, for 19 TU.  The only weapon that compares with that kind of damage on a single shot is the Unrestricted Blast mode of the Particle Beam Cannon, which does 210 damage, has a blast radius, drains the entire 8-shot clip, and costs 28 TU.

Even the Coilgun's Aimed Shot only does 180 damage for 18 TU, which is the closest direct comparison, and even then, it's not the primary fire mode of the weapon (the primary fire mode is Snap Shot; 12 TU, same damage, but 1.5 accuracy).  Further, the Coilgun's lowest accuracy is only 0.9, and does the same 180 damage as its snap shot.  I'm thinking your weapon idea might be a bit overkill; too TU-intensive to use effectively, too much damage to keep it from being gamebreaking if you can overcome the TU-cost.  And this is a laser-based weapon.  From a research standpoint, having a weapon that strong available early might be gamebreaking; it might be enough to dissuade people from researching Particle Beam or Needler weapons entirely.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2010, 06:53:52 pm by Sgt. Hatter »

Offline thunktone

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2010, 10:37:56 am »
Btw, the pistol used is UFA AI isn't 9mm. Read ufopaedia a bit.

My mistake, it's 7.62mm. Not sure why but I was assuming it would fire 9x19mm NATO.

And what are those "battle rifles" of yours supposed to be? High caliber ARs? I'm sorry that's impossible unless you want to treat your soldiers with dislodged shoulder after they try to fire burst from it.

The assault rifle in game is described as firing 4.7mm ammunition. By battle rifle I mean something like an FN FAL or Beretta BM59 which fire 7.62x51mm NATO. I'm not saying this should necessarily be included in the game, but it makes more sense IMHO than upgrading an assault rifle with alien tech.

Offline zapkitty

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2010, 12:30:26 pm »
Well... (pause) ... I was thinking of upgrades to existing weapons and not new weapons as such, but it seems that all weapons threads veer sharply towards bigger, better and above all else newer guns :)

So back to upgrades:  the ability to load a magazine with a newer type of ammo helps a lot in that regard, although ammo capacity really should be dependent on the magazine and not the weapon in weapons that use magazines.

Add-ons such as improved sighting etc should be okay.

Upgrades to the construction processes of the weapon, producing it faster and cheaper, are easy.

But upgrades to the actual structure of the weapon and/or alterations to its primary mode of operations would be something else entirely, I think.


... oh, btw... :) kerrblade shotshells, while deadly and perhaps unbalancing, wouldn't be so far out of line technically, I think. I imagine a set of 6 curved scalpel blades set in a rosette pattern in a nanocomposite base in a nanocomposite sabot, sharp edges forward. When the shell is fired the rosette will slam into the unfortunate alien, slice into the armor until the nc base smacks into the armor and the "scalpels" will then depart the base and spend a second roaming around inside the alien.

So its structured very much like the flechette rounds that the shotguns are already supposed to be loaded with except these rounds would have a very low effective range.

The result should be powder burns on the alien armor around 6 slots in a rosette pattern... and randomized alien leaking out of the lower joints of the armor.

Of course if the kerrshotshell is insufficient for the task then just as the grenade launcher can fire a king-sized version of a flechette shell...  ;D

Offline tomvondeek

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #24 on: August 12, 2010, 11:28:26 am »
Hey there, i started playing 2.3 and share same thoughts as here were indicated:

These were some ideas:


- After having researched laser you can improve sniperrifle with a better aiming laser, reducing spread a tiny bit.
- After researching kerrblade, upgrading some assaultrifles with an kerrbladebayonet making it usable for stabbing in close combat.
- Researching plasma (aliens use a way better coolingtechnoligy for their plasma weapons) you can improve laserguns with better cooling, making them shoot faster (less tp)
- For all weapons shooting bullets improved Ammunition, made out of Alien material
- improvement of grenadelauncher should make a bit higher range (btw, it should be possible to shoot/throw in a high arc standing on the one side of a wall to the other side)


Edit: Corrected Typo
« Last Edit: August 15, 2010, 12:28:54 am by tomvondeek »

Offline Thrashard96

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #25 on: August 13, 2010, 10:03:06 am »
If i was geever, i'd give you a ticket for the idea not forgettable.

But i agree with you.

Offline geever

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #26 on: August 13, 2010, 12:39:56 pm »
If i was geever, i'd give you a ticket for the idea not forgettable.

If I were geever, I'd let Winter and BTAxis consider these ideas...

-geever

Offline tomvondeek

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Re: Automatic weapons upgrades? .... and also ammo as a weapon function?...
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2010, 12:27:09 am »
So to which of my Ideas do you refer?

Basicly used the search to find topics about weapon improvements and this was the only one i found and  i don`t know what was already discussed in the past :)