UFO:Alien Invasion
General => Tactics => Topic started by: Seerorin on August 15, 2014, 08:52:19 pm
-
I have playing 2.5 and I have only one problem. I don't have the money to cover, the whole planet so I only downed 1 scout and attacked a landed scout. After that I met a horde of aliens on the metro station or something like that map. I would need suggestion for early game builds. Assault rifles are ok but dunno how to make a proper build. I'm triing to go with assault rifle+submachine gun combo(my guys can carry them without problem with basic armor) so how to organize it? I have trouble with carriing this weaponry+medkits+smoke and flash grenades. I think maybe the backpack is a bit small... Cause I cant place a rifle+4 grenades+medpack in it... Maybe there could be a dedicated rifle slot for holstering rifles(what should not work for heavy weapons). Or something...
-
Oh I mean on similarly equipped soldiers what effect the TU when they aren't encumbered. Nearly same strenght too.
-
Think about what you really need. While I tried carrying sidearms in my campaign, I found myself using them only handful of times, and only when primary weapon was totally unsuitable, like rocket launcher, flamethrower or grenade launcher. Armor, reload for primary weapon, medikit and few grenades are more important. Knives are totally useless...the only close combat weapon that has any use is plasma blade.
-
Hmm thank you. I'm using, the large SMG + assault rifle(needed the weight to train soldiers). How can I dissamble UFO-s? Cause there is only an option to destroy them what isn't giving me material what I would need+antimatter also a only come from them...
-
The subway is a very bloody map. I use at least 4 noobs (in a team of 8 ) there, running all into the southern entrance and then (the larger part) north. That tends to save civilians (and to loose noobs...).
-
AR... and SMG? Exactly what for? :D
Armor, medikit and grenades (one well-placed smoke can fix very hairy situations). I give them spare ammo only if a weapon got a tiny clip or as about 4th priority, what sidearms?
-
Oh I mean on similarly equipped soldiers what effect the TU when they aren't encumbered. Nearly same strenght too.
Iirc it´s the speed attribute of the actor that affects the TUs he has.
-
Thanks with the TU help. For sidearm I don't use sidearm. I use SMG-s as secondary in backpack and change weapons when I go in my man can easily carry the wait and sidearms looks really weak and inefficient for TU also SMG uses tons of ammo still perform pretty deadly up close and even a little further. But then maybe micro smg? It's the only other thing witch seems to do decent dmg. I have a few plasma pistols but they are scarce for ammo only 8 clips. Micro shotgun looks good but I do not know what to expect from it in combat... I have a scatter of 5, and only 15 range. Could I use these as only options for combat? Kerrblades are out of question I think. Large and don't really want to be even closer to enemy team. I use flashbangs and have smokes with me don't really knwo how smoke works so didn't used it yet. For sidearms I see it like this: pistol: you can't carry shit go with this shit, micro smg: you can carry weapons but you are using this crap to try to shoot something with it(ridicoulusly low dmg), micro shotgun: ok this packs a punch up close and personal but nothing more, Submachine Gun: ok this is what really good for close/medium engagements but ok made so it can't be used but only as a main weapon... Plasma would be good be good but I will need a lot of ammo(low skills for close) and even spare guns.
-
Ok problem solved itself. I didn't know smoke is the ultimate weapon. It is insanely strong as it is right now. I put it down. Sit in it and one man goes out. Others shoot, the alien he goes beck into smoke. Aliens don't even seem to know what hit them... Smoke works like cloak at least on medium...
-
Just make sure to cloak civilians too. Or place a few replacement targets. Since if you are completely smoked, aliens shoot at civilians, and you need as many of them as possible to survive to keep nations happy.
-
I'm working with a team witch has 37 strenght the least. XD They can carry a sh*tload of weaponry but right know I just use plasma. I don't have lasers so I have to stick with all plasma lot of stun and smoke nades. Even thinkin about dropping out my plasma guns for more grenades on all soldiers. Thinking about giving some extra weight to them somehow. Inventory space is a big trouble for me right now. I think it will be always really scarce anyways. TU's on the other hand get to be more. I don't know how much it increases not so much at the moment but if it can reach a treshhold of 37-43 for the 80-100 range of speed atribute then it would be apriciated. That would make heavy wepaons not so obsolate mid game... Also this cloak thing isn't a bug? I mean it's really looks like an exploit to me...
-
well TUs are going up slowly. my top troops have 37-38 TUs after more than 50 missions. its true i keep distance from aliens so they walk less, but still. its very hard to have more than 40TUs.
-
Don't you know how much speed they have? Cause I have an average of 26-27. Now my troops have 31-32 TU without emcumbarance.
-
more than 50 i think. i will check later.
-
Count 40 time units of movement to be safely out of sheevar plasma blade striking range. The most dangerous foe, according to my loss statistics...
In skirmish mode they seem to have <=46, a plasma blade needs 8 to wield and use. Most of the time they just use a small fraction of their TUs, but once they come into killing range their seventh sense tells them to consume the reserved 20+ time units to kill your colonel.
Yeah really, I believe the sheevar infravision thingy is nonsense, it's taken as an explanation, but the algorithm must work differently. And they also know how valuable your units are, as they sometimes clearly ignore the cannonfodder they are supposed to consume their TUs on. So I believe the AI is cheating regarding these two aspects.
-
Well the AI does cheat but it does *NOT* have IR sight, at all, not shevaars not anything else (which you can be thankful for, as you might have noticed that smoke does *not* stop IR goggles... mmmmmm maybe I should give shevaars IR sight after all mwahahahaha) but any AI unit (including civilians) know whom they'll be able to see (and shoot) from any given position before even moving there (and that's the reason aliens will beeline to you — even if you are inside a smoke cloud — if they ever come in close enough)
Also they don't know the rank of your soldiers, but know their HP so they might go for the 'best' target regardless of distance (incidentally the AI also knows the exact linear distance — but not the walking one — to any other unit, even those that they can't see or path to)
-
Hmm right now I made a bit of testin about this how they shoot at you. Yes they try to shoot for the kill. Smoke right know simply oveerpowered. Even if they don't have IR sight they should at least random fire(don't know if it can be done in the code) in to the cloud. Also that they use linear distance makes them most of the time not really able to get to your team if they can't walk into shooting position within 1-3 turns(maybe I'm not perfectly correct on this one, but seems like they can plan forward for 3 turns). If I read it correct they work as inviduals but not as a team right, and you are using simple in engine code to them. Maybe if you can cheat a little bit with coding(If I remember correctly ufo:afterlight used something like this), you can create a separeted program wich calculates movement. Only works if you can get the routing information of the game easily accessible. This way maybe you can make a better routing for them. So they will not linger at the lowest level of a building while you are killing their buddies and taking their ship on ground level.
-
Smoke is not overpowered or anything. The player needs 50% or more of civilians to survive or nations will get angry. There also needs to be a slight increase in nation happiness to support the growing upkeep cost. Protecting civilians from dying with smoke is a major tactics. In 2.4 I had all nations on exuberant in about August. It takes me until January in 2.5. The player needs his units to survive and heal quickly too. With the current generally mean map setup, which most of the time favors aliens, the campaign would be impossible without smoke. In 2.6 smoke does a little damage to units without nanocomposite armor even I've heard.
It could be different if the civilians AI or spawn positions were better, or if they wouldn't die from any snapshot already, or if the player could control them, or if they got their turn before the aliens. Sometimes spawn positions are in a way that civilians are dead for sure, since an alien is so much nearer than the player.
-
The smoke is mostly owerpowered if used correctly. Cause you can use it to not get shot, and aliens aren't so tough. I have a good sniper so I can take any tamans in early mid game who I just see. Just simply one shot him. They wear armor but it not really seems to do any good for them. My only problem is there is no direct sight lot of the times. Smoke tough can easyli save my men. Aliens don't shoot at it. Yeah sometimes Civvies dies in instant. But mostly thanks to my extreme range kill capability if I see an alien in the first round that alien is a dead alien. My concern is mostly that civilian AI not really doing anything. A freakingly large alien ship is near and they still just wandering around. I mostly just lose 2-3 civvies/mission cause I can easily take out enemies. Thinking about transition to through wall capable railgun. But dunno what in reality throughwall capability means. Maybe I will make a few videos about things like smoke and throughwall weapons after I get to know them pretty well. But only 30 dmg increase don't seem to worth it. It could if it means I can snipe from the whole map and get instant kills on sheevars. Then it could be nice. Else it's on pair with nothing... Also depends on how much accuracy improves or degrades considered to sniper rifle. Cause my sniper can hit with 66% percent when crouched from nearly map edge to map edge. If the railgun is more precise through a wall, then it's the way to go cause I if I can shoot through most walls I don't even have to move a lot just shoot them from afar... :D Sounds fun for me. :D
-
Throughwall capability is simple. It is amount of walls projectile from weapon can go. Sniper rifles and bolters have 1, coilgun 2. Every wall reduces power of projectile, and solid blocks stop any projectile (like, say, walls of ground level part of corrupter). This also works for ceilings and floors, in fact my corrupter clearing tactic (something you'll do a lot in mid-late game) is to set up long range RF around entrance with my assault troops, and use several soldiers with sniper rifles/bolters/coilguns and IR goggles to take out aliens through the floor of the UFO.
Accuracy of elite soldiers can be insane. I have, in my campaign, soldiers capable of sniping aliens on the other side of dam map...with machinegun from standing position.
-
That is quiet some sniping. Hmm so even normal sniper can shoot through 1 wall? Also I'm now got to mid game, and realized. My early despite taking 10 intact ufos and dissembling most of them. Few of them is worked on right know. Is simply just didn't any resources to start up a secondary base/team. So I'm pretty much stuck. I have two bases. Started to pump out equipment what I need. But got into trouble with low money. I have laser weapons. So secondary could be viable. With more bases. Also in desperate need of more radar cover. But there is just simply no chance... -.-This is a pretty lame stage of the game. Maybe I drop it here and now again. Cause it's idiotistic how you get no money/missions early game, and expected to suddenly be able to transition to 2-3 missions per week after 1 mission/2 weeks. Cause you can't shoot down shit with your interceptors. Fighters simply decimates even fully equipped human interceptors. Even if equipped with their very own particle cannon. That should be a bit balanced. Considering dragons are really hard to build and really late to run out to work... Exploiting base defence system is a bad idea. Not enough bases not enough space for anything... So I don't if I could just send out rookies and call it a day... Making my good soldiers die in the process wasting money on equippinf useless goons... Don't like this concept... Also exploiting smoke is feels bad for me... There could be real tactical choices not just ok achieve laser>smoke everything exploit>ok you reach a stage where you use the same tactic again again again. Pretty annoying mostly you could only do one thing in the game exploiting certain bugs. -.-
-
Also how can I get the XAW-95, or it is not an ingame campaign weapon?
-
Also how can I get the XAW-95, or it is not an ingame campaign weapon?
The weapon is skirmish-only. You could, however, get it working within the campaign by modding the script files.
-
Had to go to skirmish to check that one. Looks kinda useless compared to MG. Same goes for the alternative AR...the Half-Life style shotgun looks cool though, but only for double shot.
-
I can't even use alternate AR in skirmish. XD
-
Also I'm now got to mid game, and realized. My early despite taking 10 intact ufos and dissembling most of them. Few of them is worked on right know. Is simply just didn't any resources to start up a secondary base/team. So I'm pretty much stuck. I have two bases. Started to pump out equipment what I need. But got into trouble with low money. I have laser weapons. So secondary could be viable. With more bases. Also in desperate need of more radar cover. But there is just simply no chance... -.-This is a pretty lame stage of the game. Maybe I drop it here and now again.
You will have to, since you've made a classic strategical error: spreading your forces too thin. You should have focused on the most important things, like estabishing one full-featured base in the location when it covers as much area of funding countries as possible (Balkans are the best choice IMHO), running some combat-related research (UFO technology can wait 2-3 months), and only after that you should be covering the rest of the globe with your bases.
Single exception: installing a science base with a single interceptor and 2 SAM launchers on the other side of globe can be helpful, but don't hurry to it; you will spend the first month of game using almost all available finances for the first base and it's outside installations (UFO Yard, extra radar and SAM site).
Cause it's idiotistic how you get no money/missions early game, and expected to suddenly be able to transition to 2-3 missions per week after 1 mission/2 weeks.
Methinks it is actually makes a lull for the player when he is given some time to build his infrastructure in the way he wants.
Cause you can't shoot down shit with your interceptors. Fighters simply decimates even fully equipped human interceptors.
Attack in packs, try to lure UFOs in your SAM range.
Exploiting base defence system is a bad idea.
Why? Everything is fair in times of war. Especially if it is the war against us all.
Not enough bases not enough space for anything...
The whole point of the game is repelling the alien invasion with some quite limited resources. Resource management and careful planning is what it is about, both in the geoscape and the battlescape.
Changing this will turn UFO:AI into a completely different game, and this is not in the plans af far as I know.
-
I have my first base full. It's fully developed into a mostly research base. With just two workshops cause with one I can't do anything. I installed my second base with just an interceptor and basic things just for an interceptor nothing more. But know I have to many ufos also has to change weaponry to laser and armor to nanocomposite. So I had money to build four workshops on the second base. So I can finally start producing also want to move my ufo site there. But here came the trouble. I just simply run dry in just one month. If I don't build them. I'm simply getting owherwhelmed by the enemy... -.- Also I need a second team FOr that I could need one more base... Wich I also don't have money for... So dunno how to solve this... XD
-
I am not sure where your complaint comes from. Games are not meant to be "push button and win". If you are not winning, you are doing something wrong. Next time, do something different.
FWIW, I break ground on my second base immediately, and keep both small (one or two labs or workshops at most, 10 or so soldiers) for a few months, running 4 interceptors and 2 ground combat teams. Other than for research purposes, I sell most downed UFOs, and am quite aggressive at selling alien gear I have no immediate use for, and the products of UFO dissasembly. For around 6 months I am very short on cash as I build up my bases, focussing on production as even with 4 labs at most I can keep my research on top of my workshop orders list, and 2 bases (one in the USA, one in eastern Turkey) allows me to keep nearly everyone on the globe happy despite a high casualty rate amongst my troops using captured alien weapons. This shortage of cash continues until 12 months or so in when I can send out nanocomp armoured and laser armed squads - by then, the balance of force on the ground is in my favour and I can begin turning a profit through selling the alien weapons and build up a stock of cash from better funding. It is very easy when new to the game to allow your research to outpace your production capacity, leading you to think there must be something wrong as you have 4 or 5 newly researched things waiting to be made - reel in your research a little and add in some more production capacity. Things that have been researched are technically useless unless you can get them into combat, and often this means making them. Why rush researching things if you lack the capacity to utilize them?
TL;DR - go for smaller bases to establish more of a global presence to secure funding rather than one megabase - labs and workshops are expensive and you can do most of the early to mid game production and research with a small number of labs and a slightly greater production bias.
-
My concern is that no replacement is there for soldiers. So If I go in to deal with aliens I have really hard time not cause of game difficulty problems(losing 1-2 soldiers isn't a concern if you can get good once). But in this game losing a mediom soldier who as an average skill of 40 on his main weapons is costly thing. Cause as you progress you have to carry more and more weapons and armor. But no more problems. My team can carry enough smokes. So no problem. I don't really like the idea. Spiders became a concern this way. But most aliens can be easily taken care of. So I started my transition to laser weapons. Pretty easy if you can take on two missions in one flight without losing soldiers. I'm running low on smokes tough but those are cheap considering a soldier with a 40 average worth about 50000. Cause if I bring a new soldier with armor weapons etc. It's costs about 12000 not even quarter of them survive on midgame battlefields for 10 missions wich is sufficient to get in this threshold. So the secondary team idea dropped. Soldiers are priceless. So you have to spend every possible money to make them survive. Cause other way in the endgame you will have not so good soldiers. :)
-
Why rush researching things if you lack the capacity to utilize them?
The earlier you research something, the earlier you can buy it. It seems. No need to prevent your workshops from doing the only thing that produces cash instead of consuming it - disassembling UFOs. Indirectly.
-
The whole buy it earlier thing is true, but only for things you can buy.
-
Well, what things are there that one needs urgently and which cannot be bought ?
-assault rifle and machine gun EP ammunition: too expensive in comparison to ammunition for laser weapons; even needler ammunition is cheaper than machine gun EP ammunition and that's a similar weapon (and it comes for free from aliens)
-sniper rifle EP ammunition: useful for sharpshooters struggling from weigh, but coilgun clip and even electromagnetic rifle magazines are to be preferred whenever possible (both cheaper and more precise)
-PB grenades for the grenade launcher: useful, aside from that the grenade launcher may not be necessary in many missions
-electromagnetic rifle antimatter magazine: not really needed, its almost never a problem to fire twice - I always have at least 2 sharpshooters in the team for throughwall shots, and if it's not throughwall you should have an assault trooper around
-gas grenades: no idea, I never got to use these yet; do they create a field that stays similar to incendiary grenades ? If not, not worth it probably.
-aerial laser cannon and base-defense laser turret: only needed in small numbers and aren't used up
-hybrid missile: there are enough antimatter missiles from disassembling UFOs
-alien aircraft plating, alien polymer armor: needed, though you should maybe first research the ladder and only produce that
-Herakles and Raptor dropships: needed
-Dragon interceptor: not worth it yet, research Starchaser
-Starchaser and Stingray: needed
Everything else can either be bought or comes from battles or disassembling UFOs in sufficient numbers.
I like to produce a little field equipment at the point it cannot yet be bought or not in sufficient numbers, for instance, laser rifle, armors, coilgun. But not worth doing in large numbers, in the case of weapons only if the corresponding ammunition can be bought already.
-
For me, armour is a bottleneck. It takes so long for armours to be available for purchase in the quantities I would like that I find myself spending a long time making them.
EP rounds though are well worth the time and money investment, when compared to needler and laser weapons, and for rookie snipers.
-
Armor is a must have for my troopers. Also plasma rifles aren't up the task in open maps. So I want to transition to laser weapons. Would like to carry a lasrifle+plasma rifle combo but to change for situation is too damn slow. So probably will stay with plasma pistols. Didn't really used them though nearly all my soldiers are carriing one. But too slow to take it out and shoot it. Laser do little damage so not worth it. Probably a mix of plasma and laser rifles will do the trick. Or something like that. Still testing the builds after transition.
-
There is literally no point in carrying both a laser rifle and plasma rifle. I don't get where you think that Laser rifles do little damage - they will tear through pretty much anything other than heavy armoured enemies with ease. I drop plasma rifles totally once I get lasers into the field.
-
well plasma full auto is great. lasers are for greater ranges. so i use mixed. after beam i still use mixed. beam, plasma, laser.
about coil guns so great... dont thay have only 2 ammo? where sniper rifle got 8 ammo.
-
I find that a pulsed fire laser burst is just as effective at dispatching enemies from close in with the laser, for less TU's. 2 ammo for the coil gun is often more than enough to last a moderate length mission.
-
There is literally no point in carrying both a laser rifle and plasma rifle. I don't get where you think that Laser rifles do little damage - they will tear through pretty much anything other than heavy armoured enemies with ease. I drop plasma rifles totally once I get lasers into the field.
Well, for killing a full-health Sheevar running to you with reaction fire it seems you need all three beams to hit (12 TU shot of laser rifle) whereas it only needs 2 plasma balls from the plasma rifle (12 TU shot).
On the other hand, hitting with all 6 beams from 2x 12 TU shot of a laser rifle should kill a full-health Ortnok IIRC. Maybe it needs 1 small shot more. But the medium alien armor protects well against plasma, so it seems worth to field both, depending on the soldier role.about coil guns so great... dont thay have only 2 ammo? where sniper rifle got 8 ammo.
4 in 2.5. That ammo is very cheap and it can shoot through 3 walls (key point). 2 replacement packs recommended for longer missions.
-
So laser can really cut through armor then. Also railgun pentretion. How it works? Can someone tell me? Cause I don't know how much that thing worth it. Sma 3 wall penetration? What walls aren't penetrable?
-
thin walls. thats the thinest walls of structures. if you can go with your solider on one tile and with other solider on tile next to it and there is wall between them - thats thin wall.
4 in 2.5. That ammo is very cheap and it can shoot through 3 walls (key point). 2 replacement packs recommended for longer missions.
hmmm. worth researching than. i used in 2.4 only once. will give another try now in 2.6 even if im already at end. (bomber researched needler not) ;D
-
You can only find out which walls are sniper-shootable by trying. The side hulls of corrupters and harvester aren't, but the floor of the wings of corrupters are (strange). On military bunker I managed to shoot through the thick (!) wall to the large chamber near the northeastern entrance to the upper level. Walls of buildings on industry themed maps, suburban city, African village and such can generally be shot through. The floors in city high rise and subway maps, so you can stand above the target and hit from complete safety. Snapshot works, since the spatial distance is very short. Walls of crew quarters in base defense missions can be shot through; their top level doesn't have any opening so sniper is perfectly safe.
You don't kill most of the time, or need several hits, but bleeding often suffices as aliens don't ever use medkits.
-
actually also harvester have some thin walls in lower floor.
and in base its good if you have living quarters close to entrance. get sniper in upper floor and have fun with aliens waliking in and out ;D
also works living quarters near worksop, dropship hangar.
-
and in base its good if you have living quarters close to entrance. get sniper in upper floor and have fun with aliens waliking in and out ;D
also works living quarters near worksop, dropship hangar.
But that could scatter your initial positions too much, perhaps so that some soldiers (perhaps just 1 - very bad) are separated from the others, with enemies on both sides.
-
maybe not for first base but for ditional bases. entrance + worksops + dropship hangar together (points where alien can got in to you base) command center, living quaters, hospital together - next to previous (points where your soliders spawn) since i have some really good soliders its no problem to have them in pairs. but never have only one solider alone. since they cant heal themself.
its also good if you have entrance than something like small hangar, or powerolant and than command centre. distance is bigger so if you have snipers thay can hit alines good while aliens have smallerc hance of hitting them back. later on when aliens use needlers also RF from snipers is effective.
-
My usual builds: Assault unit-assault rifle,medkit,2 aditional mags,armor,IR and 1 flashbang and grenade. MG guy-MG,medkit,IR,armor and 2 of each nades (sometimes 4 smoke and 2 flash). Sniper-sniper rifle,2 aditional mags,armor,medkit,IR and 2 smoke nades. However, i first search for all of my soldiers to have atleast 35 strenght and 25 acuracy. If the unit has both but its not specialized in assault or sniper, he gets the MG