UFO:Alien Invasion
General => Tactics => Topic started by: weekendwarriora1c on May 19, 2010, 02:05:15 am
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My favorite: The Grenade Launcher
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It's situational, but grenade launcher, sniper rifle and machine gun so far. Then again, I had to restart after the savegame break, so I haven't gotten around to using the more advanced stuff yet.
I do prefer the electromagnetic rifle to the assault rifle because it does more damage and has a better range and it allows developing both assault and sniper weapon skills.
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Flame-throwers, lasers and coil-guns.
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Flamers, heavy lasers, machine guns, grenade launchers.
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My favorite: The Grenade Launcher
in this situation i suggest you must hit the alien's head very hard with the grenade launcher.
or else arrange it so that a grenade would explode in front of the alien and the alien's body might serve as a cover for you.
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he might have flechette shells loaded. The final colonoscopy.
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indeed. "flechette shells be mightily mean up close t' fleshy landlubbers!" ;D
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Yeah. Three-round burst with flechettes.
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Snipers, Riot Shottys and Rocket Launcher
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Interesting....been playing on normal diff, and never found a reason to use shotguns or RL.
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Found the Riot Shotgun to be one of my favourites, especially at close range bout 10 or less grid spaces, the Rocket Launcher is good for thinning numbers if the Aliens are stupid enough to remain in my line of sight
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Although the alien heavy armour will wreck it i love the machine gun early on , as at least some of the bullters will hit the alien at medium -long range and it works great at medium -close range =Lead dragon
I have not had the choice to play the coil gun it sound like fun for now i love the sniper rifle
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I also have found a new appreciation for the riot shotgun. It just needs a crowded map and/or a soldier with high accuracy.
Though a machine gun can still get impressive results and has a great damage output. Yesterday one of my machine gunners racked up four kills in a single mission. The machine gun is also my absolute favorite for starting fighter crash missions if you can line it up to get more than one alien in one full burst.
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The machine gun is also my absolute favorite for starting fighter crash missions if you can line it up to get more than one alien in one full burst.
My gunner scored three kills with one full burst once. The mission was over during my first round.
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MY favorite weapon is G-3
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Don't underestimate the power of the MG. I usually have 2 troops packing them even late in the game. Their demoralizing power quickly cows aliens over great distances even if "O'l Painless" lands only a bullet or two ("We hit nothing"). It's meant to do just that, it's a "support weapon". Support troops lay down an intimidating wall of lead while the assault troops flank around. Nothing like watching a few aliens assume the fetal position for a couple rounds while the grunts move in. On top of that, now and then I run into a batch of aliens lined up like ducks at a shooting gallery just around a corner that all bow down to the power of a single full-auto spray. Grenade launcher is great for those targest behind stumps, walls and garbage bins, and especially for those buggers dug in like ticks on top of a high building ("Got time to duck?"). The heavy laser, though low damage against armor, has damn good accuracy even over medium to large distance with a 3 round spread. Sword/pistol combo is my favorite for up-close and personal. Medkit=must, all my troops have one. WTF does the smoke grenade do? I haven't notice any decrease for alien accuracy chucking one in futile attempts at protecting civilians... old X-COM games, smoke grenades were pimp, severely decreasing accuracy and vision allowing for a wide variety of tactical implementation. In this, they just take up space. I might as well put a Pepsi can in place of a smoke grenade on my holster. My troop could at least then enjoy a refreshing beverage after hosing down a cowering Tammy.
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[...]Grenade launcher is great for those targest behind stumps, walls and garbage bins, and especially for those buggers dug in like ticks on top of a high building ("Got time to duck?"). The heavy laser, though [...]
nice post, but at this point, i think you somehow lost the style.
grenade launchers are nice when the enemy is round the corner, but nothing compares to a full auto spray.
wouldn't that be better? with your wording, of course.
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1) rocket lancher.
i have soldier quick enough to fire and reload in one turn. i did shot alien in the opposite border of a big map in two turn. it's rock.
2) grenade launcher
i kill tree aliens in one turn thanks to that.
i prefer RL on openmap ( it's not realy usefull went you are in a stair...) but alien takes damage if they are in the area of the explosion, that's great.
i prefer GL in case you don't want to enter a building. you send the 3 grenade rafale and the place is secured, more over it does not aim in streat line, you can play with rebound...
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My favorite weapon combination/team setup is:
2 Laser Rifles, 2 Plasma Rifles, 1 Grenade Launcher, 2 Riot shotguns with Sabot, 1 Heavy Laser Gun or Machine Gun
Even with very tough skinned/armored aliens, I find this combination very effective. Haven't gotten to the top tier weapons yet to say, but for majority of the game you come out good with this combination.
Hands down medium short to close combat weapon of choice is the shotgun with sabot rounds. One soldier can drop two aliens easily with it, even the tougher aliens it has good success.
On regular terror missions and entrenched aliens, hit and run long range attacks of course work best. Picks off the weaklings and the idiots while my close quarters and plasma rifle teams come in and hose them down dead.
Aliens were never really good at CQB, and I intend to make sure they don't succeed in CQB in SP.
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I kinda prefer this setup: 2 Heavy lasers, 2 Machine guns, flamer, plasma rifle, grenade launcher, rocket launcher. Heavy lasers work as snipers/RF suppression fire, machineguns are all-range general purpose weapons, plasma rifle and flamer are CQB, RL and GL are indirect fire support.
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Flamethrowers. Just so damned reliable. If it's in range, it's dead. No luck, no chance, it just dies. Since quite a fair bit of time is spent with greenhorns, the flamer really stands out in that period. The riot shotgun can fail with a threeround sabot burst at the same range, and will lose effiency against armour very quickly if you're using flechettes, but for the same TU's the flamer always gets the job done.
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That's right, flamers require no skill from soldier, and it takes just 20 TU to take down even ortnok in medium armor.
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Nothing quite like toasting alien flesh. ;D
I once killed 2/3 ortnoks with one inferno spread, just gotta love that.
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FlameThrowers and Heavy Lazer Rifles, cause when you have 6 guys with them, 1 on the flamer and 1 on whatever you want it's going so much better, most of the time it's while recovering downed Aircrafts, if it's not that, then i tend to use more Heavy guns...
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Starting out: 2 Assault rifles, 2 GLs, 2 Snipers, 2 Flamethrowers. Pretty basic.
Mid game: 1 Flamethrower, 2 Heavy Lasers, 2 GLs, 1 Sniper (which really should be a Heavy Laser), 2 Plasma Rifles.
I find that GL is just unsurpassed in the reliability of kills. 3-round airburst for 15 TUs is an almost guaranteed kill at medium ranges until you get Ortnoks in heavy armor. If you feel creative you can even have a good chance at long range kills using timed bounce grenades.
Reliability is #1 on crash landings when you start close to the UFO with all your guys out in the open. GLs can normally take down two aliens when they start close enough with one 15-TU shot. This whilst your other weapons are as inaccurate as shit and need multiple hits. Flamethrower is my next favourite for crash missions because kills are guaranteed. Early in the game the range is even better than sniper rifles, because you can walk quite far and still have 8 TUs left to take down a Taman 5 squares away.
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Does using the Flamer really work with the crummy reaction fire in version 2.3?
I used to put them to use in 2.2 when the Inferno-guy could at least approach a dangerous corner with RF on, possibly even being backed up by some squad-member with a ranged weapon. Here already, the problem was usually that aliens are too far away to actually get to them without running out of TUs right in front of them.
In 2.3 I fired my Inferno-guy after the first couple battles: I don't see why I should constantly risk a squad members life just because my team is too stupid to provide cover-fire for him.
Cowardly playing the hit and run game behind corners that are further away from the Kerrblades and Plasma-pistols seems much more promising. ;)
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Does using the Flamer really work with the crummy reaction fire in version 2.3?
It does for me. I've had really good success with camping a flamer outside a landed harvester and waiting for the aliens to pop out and french frying them.
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Jesus, how many weapons does this game have? LOL.
Does the game have my favorite weapon: Dual wield pistols?
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Jesus, how many weapons does this game have? LOL.
Does the game have my favorite weapon: Dual wield pistols?
No, and won't have ever.
-geever
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Well if you wield one laser and plasma pistol and shoot with any of them, at least it looks like the soldier shoots with both ;D hehe
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No, and won't have ever.
-geever
... and there was much rejoicing...
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Hey geever: the description for the laser pistol reads:
Thanks to extremely high accuracy inherent in laser weaponry, it will be easy for ambidextrous soldiers to use two laser pistols at once.
Hopefully, this is just an inaccurate description?
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Several ufopaedia articles about pistol type weaponry mention dualwielding...that is inconsistent with game.
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Several ufopaedia articles about pistol type weaponry mention dualwielding...that is inconsistent with game.
Well, you can dual wield, just can't dual shoot...
I see there is not much love for old Bolter. The crazy accuracy of the laser weapons just overshadow it even with its supposed better armor penetration. Still, it is a decent weapon and I like at least 1 assult guy using it, just because I like the concept. The 3 shot burst gets the job done quite well up to medium ranges. Perhaps its accuracy needs to be increased a bit to make it more viable as a semi sniper as the description and "aimed shot" ability suggest. For some reason the "snap shot" mode tend to miss much more than expected even from very short range (or does not do damage?).
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Every.
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Bolters might get some more love if laser damage were attenuated from smoke or the like as mentioned in the laser descriptions; judging from g_combat.c, their damage is currently not affected by this (unless the "throughWall" flag actually is being used for this purpose).
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I love the laser rifle, to the point of using it against things I really shouldn't (i.e. armored Ortnoks).
I do have a little love for the riot shotgun, though, for some silly reason.
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My modded weaps.
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Ah, I remember my modding days... auto-lasers, plasma snipers, massively long range flamer's. good times...
...although, personally, I prefer making the game crazier than easier now... I remember when I modded the plasma rifle to be insanely deadly and made the alien armours almost invincible, then played a skirmish map with one godlike almost invincible super-alien vs my team of flamer snipers. that was crazy...
Enough of my rambling!
Paul, could I have a copy of your modded weapons so I could have a look at them? pretty please? :3
(also, do you mind if I just call you Paul?)
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Ah, I remember my modding days... auto-lasers, plasma snipers, massively long range flamer's. good times...
...although, personally, I prefer making the game crazier than easier now... I remember when I modded the plasma rifle to be insanely deadly and made the alien armours almost invincible, then played a skirmish map with one godlike almost invincible super-alien vs my team of flamer snipers. that was crazy...
Enough of my rambling!
Paul, could I have a copy of your modded weapons so I could have a look at them? pretty please? :3
(also, do you mind if I just call you Paul?)
Yes, you can call me Paul, but my name in our country is Paulius...
And the copy is only with assault rifle and modded rpg ;D for now... Oh well... Take all...
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thank you Paul. X3
now, lets give these puppies a go!
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I was thinking about a new weapon which regenerates ammo 50/0 (the /0 is for the magazine, but it doesn't use it anyways), but i don't know how to do it. Anyone knows?
P.S. Also i need to make meson tech as a plasma/laser mixture, can anyone help?
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Hmm... a recharging gun... the only way I can think of is giving said weapon insanely high ammo... or is it possible for a gun fire mode to actually create ammo instead of use it? if so, you could just make a 'recharge' fire mode that restores the ammo.
as for the tech, what do you need help with? adding research?
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I think so... ;D
But the weapon would be really insane if you make it. The destruction would be really endless...
But i meant about recharging at the end of the turn...
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Hmmmmmmm.
Eyeballing the 2.4 trunk, I notice that the Bolter has a 'throughwall' flag of 2 (which, judging from quick grep + skim, means that it should be able to penetrate up to two walls of thickness less than 8... units of some sort, at reduced damage (the first penetration divides damage by sqrt(2), I think; the second, again by sqrt(3)). For comparison, all human laser weapons lack a throughwall value, the sniper rifle = 1, the coilgun = 3, and the chain gun has throughwall = 5.
As a side note, weapon preferences might change if the display showed estimates of post-armor damage (after, say, you've already researched the armor).
e.g. (all numbers from 2.4-trunk)
laser rifle: using pulsed fire, 3 shots, laser-medium damage type, "42 5" damage value. 12 TUs cost.
If I read the code right, each shot can do 37-47 points before armor... but then, we subtract damage reduction from armor. Alien medium armor reduces laser_medium damage by 26, so that's 11-21 points per shot or 33-63 for 12 TUs if you hit 100%.
Damage is adjusted for difficulty after armor reduction, and is a multiplier, not a flat bonus/reduction.
heavy laser: using pulsed fire, 15 TUs, 3 shots, laser-heavy, "52 6".
46-58, subtract alien medium armor damage reduction vs. laser-heavy of 24, means 22-34 per shot or 66-102 damage for 15 TUs if you hit 100%.
sniper rifle: aimed shot, 18 TUs, normal-heavy, "105 0".
105 pts, subtract medium armor DR of 22 = 83 damage for 18 TUs.
coil gun: aimed shot, 18 TUs, normal-heavy, "180 36"...
144-216 pts, subtract 22 = 122-194 points for 18 TUs
bolter rifle: 3-round burst, 14 TUs, normal-heavy, "75 10" -
65-85 pts, subtract 22, 43-63 x3 ~ 129-189 if you hit 100%.
submachine gun, 15-shot full auto, 18 TUs, normal-light, "20 4" -
16-24 pts, subtract 31 from medium armor = you do the minimum 1 pt per shot that hits
flamethrower: 60-shot Inferno, 12 TUs, fire_flamer, "6 2" -
4..8, less 3 from medium armor = 1..5 per shot that hits - 60..300 if you hit 100%, but average a very nasty 180.
particle beam cannon "Unrestricted Blast", 1 8-ammo-using shot, 28 TUs, splash damage of "210 20", particlebeam-heavy, blast radius = 4:
if at ground zero, damage = 190-230, less 24 point reduction from medium armor == you're still toast. ;)
damage at 3 units away = 190..230 x (1-3/4) = 47.5..57.5, less armor reduction = 19.5..29.5.
particle beam rifle vs. nanocomposite armor, 15 TU aimed shot (particlebeam-medium), "90 15" --
75-105 damage, less 17 from armor - 58-88 damage.
plasma blade vs. nanocomposite armor, 7 TU 'lock' "300 5", plasma-heavy
295-305, less... 20 points, but it doesn't matter...
kerrblade vs. nanocomposite armor, 14 TU slash, "180 45" monomolecular --
135-225, less 12 = 123-213 points.
For reference, a Taman should have 100-130 health, Ortnoks 120-160, Shevaar 120-160, Bloodspiders 150, and your average new recruit 80-110.
As a side note (noticing this because they're in the same file...) 1% chance for any of your singleplayer-game recruits to be 'elite'... which gives them FAR higher starting stats. Strength 25-35, Speed 25-35, Accuracy 30-40, Mind 30-45, weapon skills 25-40, health 100-130. For comparison, other recruits will have 15-25 strength and speed, 20-30 accuracy, 20-35 mind, and either 15-25 all weapon skills (non-specialists) or 25-40 in one weapon skill and 13-23 in the rest. :o
Taman soldiers will have far higher stats (accuracy 40-50, weapon skills 50-90); what hurts their hitting ability is that they don't crouch much when shooting, and that they tend to have weapons with higher spread values.
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those who like sure kill may love plasma sword in close combat. they never mention it! But it's the only weapon i never see failed.
grenade are great cause of their unique ballistic and rocket launcher cause aliens asked my to stop to use it. To give more details, a assume that i switch rocket launcher for flamer in big city stairs.
explosive mustn't be overused in small pieces
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Hi all,
I have played this game since 1.X so I can say I'm a bit experienced. I have 2 grenade launchers(the best soldiers - 222x266 and 132x166, means more than one killed alien per game) equipped by PB grenades, then 2 sniper riflemen and the rest is equipped by laser guns, mostly rifles and just one by heavy one. I can usually finish the crash site games by the first round(scout and fighter) but harvesters are more complicated, especially in the desert..
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My favorite weapon is the flamer. Burning alien is so good and it's an excellent weapon in most map when their is not only long range shooting, storming buiding and ships with it is pure gold .
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I am not wery far in the game so my expirience is a little limited: So far my favorites are Flamethrover and GL! I usually have two GLs on mu squad! One is armed with the basic `nades and the other one is used as the evil big brother of the shotgun! One soldier, GL + Flechettes and 6 tamans on a harvester. Three turns later there are One soldier, GL + Flechettes and a LOT of ground meat on that same harvester! :D
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Nix on the flechettes once you run into well-armored aliens -- a flechette blast is weak shots, each of which has its damage massively reduced by armor. At that point, stick with the explosive rounds (or plasma, once you have some).
Flamethrowers tend to stay useful, particularly for ambushing at convenient choke points where the short range doesn't matter.
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No worries! My new favourite duetto is Lazor + plasma rifles! You just CAN`T miss with the lazors! And you get an IMMENSE supply of plasma weaponry for free! (How generous the dead aliens can be!)Bolter rifle`s armor penentration is nice though... Armored Ortnok bites the dust after three hits, but to hit that ortnok three times you have to be at kissing range which isn`t something you want to do... So Plasma and Laser rifles are my favorites! Bolter COULD be if it would hit something!
EDIT: MG is also on my list of favorites! Hawing a soldier spraying full auto to scare those pescy aliens to shooting everything useless near them (even eachother) is just great! It is funny that a soldier shoots the MG like the RAMBO! ;D
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Bolter rifle`s armor penentration is nice though... Armored Ortnok bites the dust after three hits, but to hit that ortnok three times you have to be at kissing range which isn`t something you want to do...
Bear in mind that you can *shoot through most walls* with them, at reduced damage. You can't shoot through the exterior side walls of an intact harvester (too thick, AFAICT), but you *can* shoot through, say, from the ground level to the upper deck through the ceiling/floor, or from right outside the back through the thin walls around the doorway. You can shoot through a window, through the roof of an ordinary building, and nail a target to whom you didn't even have line of sight (with that shooter; *somebody* should spot so you know where to shoot)...
A Bolter has a 'throughwall' factor of 2. The first wall the shot goes through, divides damage by sqrt(2) (to 46-65 from the original 65-85); the second wall, by an additional sqrt(3) (to ~26.5-34.7) and /then/ you subtract the armor's value against the shot's damage weight. Medium alien armor subtracts 22 from the relevant damage weight, so
# walls / no armor / light alien armor (12pt) / medium (22)
0 / 65-85 / 53-73 / 43-63
1 / 46-60 / 34-48 / 24-38
2 / 26.5-34.7 / 14.5-22.7 / 4.5-12.7
So vs. medium armor, a burst through one wall can still hurt nastily (72-114 if you hit 100%), and against an unarmored opponent a three-round burst through two walls is still vicious, but it's not that useful against a medium-armored opponent.
For comparison, a sniper rifle has a throughwall of 1, so it can penetrate one wall, but it has a higher base damage of 105 (always) and the same damage type (normal_heavy), so again 12 or 22 pt reduction.
# walls / no armor / light armor / medium armor
0 / 105 / 93 / 83
1 / 74 / 62 / 52
The coilgun has a throughwall of 3, the same damage type, and a damage of 180+/- 36 (thus 144-216). This results in
# walls / no armor / light armor / medium armor
0 / 144-216 / 132-204 / 122-194
1 / 102-153 / 90-141 / 80-131
2 / 59-88 / 47-76 / 37-66
3 / 29-44 / 17-32 / 7-22
For reference, civvies should have ~5-10 health, Tamans 100-130, Ortnoks 150-190, Shevaars 120-160, Bloodspiders 150. So a three-round Bolter burst through a single wall (100% hit: 138-180, 102-144, 72-114 health for no armor, light alien and medium alien respectively) is pretty significant. Now consider that judging from the 2.3.1 source there seems to be no penalty to precision or accuracy for shooting at a completely obscured target (just significantly reduced damage for when you hit, up to the number of thin walls allowed -- zero for most weapons), and therefore the odds of hitting somebody who's just on the other side of the wall/ceiling are pretty high, and that the aliens have no weapons which can return fire through a solid wall...
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AutoCannon in support of squaddies with rifles. Beware of the splash, though.
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I am starting to like lasers immensely now that I have found some time to produce them en masse. A tightly packed group of 4 heavy LAZOR and 4 LAZOR riflemen are an invincible nut to crack. I occasionally swap 1 laser rifler with plasma rifle, to go to assault mode and lay down autofire.
(http://images.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/6/6d/Morelazer.jpg)
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My favorite (start and mid game) is for every soldier i have - to have:
either grenade launcher or sniper. The other gun in the backpack. And medikit and one piece of sniperammo and grenade ammo extra.
Since its impossible for me to know where my soldiers start at every map, and the map is not possible to prepare for I think 8 versatile killers is the best way to go strategicly. I figured this out pretty fast.. And its kind of dull that I guess I am actually right.
I think weapons should be some way restricted to skills (or classes like sniper, assault heavy, Flamers etc)
If its possible to equip everyone with the same kind of weapons (which is the pretty much the best setup) , and it works very good for all players, some of the strategy concept (which i like) that includes having diverse weapons and relying on teammates, etc get less important.
With my setup I can just throw away the sniper and use the grenadelauchner if necessary (or otherway around). The Sniper from kneestanding kills most aliens giving some chances from all over the map. grenades wipes all mid-close combat. even snapshots from sniper is good in close combat :/
The tactics and weaponchosing should be based more on what skill the players have. SOme should really suck at sniper and grenadelauncher, and maybe just be good assault men.
I think its a bit imbalanced that every player do (pretty) well with sniper rifle and a grenade launcher. There should maybe be training courses (target shooting) to learn using the weapons so less can use them (with good results)
I also thinks the old weapons get obsolite to quick. There should be a incentive to use them for a longer period. Maybe other ammo should be much more expensive. And maybe e.g. 7.62 ammo etc could be replaced by better tech bullets or covered with poison etc later on.
This is my experience playing hard difficulty playing maybe 70 missions on 2.3.1 - guess im newbie compared to many here, but hey - i want to make the game better - hope this helps :)
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Picking just one favorite weapon? Man, that's a tough job.
As has been said, the Bolter isn't necessarily a BAD weapon. It's more inaccurate than a sniper rifle, shotgun, or assault rifle. But it does a decent enough job of combining all three into a single package. The three-round burst on a Bolter is especially dangerous. Ortnoks beware. I generally only carry one on my squad, but he's the guy who can do any job. You don't want a laser rifleman running into a building to trade blows with a medium-armored Ortnok, but the Bolter guy can do it. Hell, the Bolter guy probably doesn't even have to go into the building himself. He can just blast the Ortnok through the walls.
The Flamer is another nice one. As has been said, it's reliable. No randomness involved. If the target is in range, it's going to take full damage (barring partial cover), and that full damage is more than enough to roast any alien when set to Inferno mode. You'll find no better option for reaction fire at close ranges. Setting a flamer on either side of a Harvester's doors is a perfect death-trap. They're the perfect weapon for an untrained rookie.
Grenade launchers are another fine choice. Not exactly my style, but they have their uses. Firing over obstacles with a three-round airburst is a death-sentence for most aliens. Within their range, they're great. I haven't had much success with the flechette rounds, though. I've fired a three-round burst into an unarmored Taman from 1 square away and it didn't die. I'm using 2.4-Dev, so it may be a bug. *Shrug*
Then, of course, there are the riot shotguns, assault rifles, machine guns, sniper rifles, lasers, and the lot. They all have their charms. In the end, however, I'm gonna have to go with the coilgun as my favorite weapon, despite the assorted drawbacks, if only because I built one of my own back in highschool. It was barely powerful enough to fire a slug more than five feet and wouldn't have put anyone's eye out even if they were staring straight down the barrel, but coilguns will always have a special significance for me.
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If I had to pick only one weapon, it's laser rifle. Extremely accurate, fairly good damage, low TU cost equal excellent all-arounder for your average assault rifle grunt.
That's the top one, but the flamer and grenade launcher would go to the top three. The flamer is the most reliable weapon in it's range and kills anything as long as the agent has at least 12 TU and some ammo left. The GL, on the other hand, is very versatile weapon, capable of arcing through windows, air-bursting in the middle of a field or turning aliens into Swiss cheese with flechette indoors.
After that, things get rather situational, but one of those things can usually handle it at least decently.
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My favorite is Machine Gun. Full auto can mow down any enemy on close range, even multiple enemies when placed right, and the amount of lead almost guarantees a couple of hits even across most maps. TU cost is just right for look-shoot-back to cover tactics...
Second is Grenade Launcher. Its huge power and area of effect can result in such extremes as six aliens killed by single soldier during one battle, especially at maps where some groupings of aliens occur.
Heavy Laser has been my primary sniper weapon for most of the game. Versatile, high powered weapon capable of hitting bullseye through entire map. Only problem is high ammo consumption.
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I'm going to have to give my vote to the humble Bolter. It doesn't handle any one job particularly well, but it's just so damn versatile that it's impossible not to love it. It's pretty much the perfect battle rifle, capable of dishing out incredible damage at point-blank ranges and making precision shots at longer distances, not to mention the fact that it's able to shoot straight through most cover. Bolter troopers should never be sent in unsupported, of course, and it takes a skilled trooper to use one effectively, but they're still handy weapons. I keep exactly two Bolters in every one of my team loadouts at all times. The remainder of my standard team loadout consists of two longer-ranged troops - snipers in the early game, Laser Rifles in the mid-to-late - two dedicated CQB troopers armed with either flamers or shotguns, and two heavy weapons troopers - one explosive, one not - whose loadout I change situationally based on the mission description, usually settling on an MG and a GL in the early to mid game, and a Heavy Laser and a GL in the late game.
For backup weapons/sidearms, the Plasma Pistol wins in my book, decent accuracy at mid-range and absolutely terrifying damage output at close range. It's a big weapon but it balances that out with small magazines.
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SMG for fun - but it's dead useless after armour starts showing up.
MG will last a while, though, and is crazy good on "bridge" and a few others.
I'm one of those weird people that think that "old" tech is cooler.
I'd rather see pistols and basic weapons be more useful. As is, if you play smart it's a cold day in hell before you get much use out the smaller secondary weapons. You basically have to screw up for them to be useful.
The plasma/laser/blaster stuff is cool and all, but ...meh. I guess I'm just steampunk and old-fashioned. Bigger and flashier and glitzier and more fantastic and nuclear explosion-y isn't always better.
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I've been messing with plasma blaster, and found MG superior to it. Out of plasma weapons, pistol is best because it is sidearm, greatly complementing laser weaponry or sniper type weapons. Rifle is okay general purpose weapon, kinda deciding if I should use that or bolter. I know some people like laser rifle, but I found its lack of damage against heavily armored enemies quite problematic.
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This is the third time i´ve posted on this thread?
Anyway, I think my final favourites will be:
1.Bolter! Against all odds i found it a good weapon, because its ridicilous damage output. It´s accuracy and clip size are pathetic, but i compensate the first one by using only soldiers sufficently trained with the impossible-to-miss laser rifles.
2. Laser rifles. I use theese as the standard weapon for my troops. Pretty much guaranteed hit! Somewhat poor damage output compensated by low TU-cost and acceptable ammo consuption (and accuracy!!!). Mainly giwen to rookiees those of them who survive to be skilled enough will be granted the title of Bolterier. :D
3. Sniper. I dislike it's lacking accuracy and damage... first one can be explained by short barrel, but the second one? It uses 20mm rounds! It could be classed as a cannon! Still in the hands of a ACCURATE soldier it can prowide some long-range softening, in the hands of your avarage rookiee though, it only provides civilian casulties... Still a nice weapon in need of a buff.
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Speaking of weapons, I got a question. I got already a good team (ranks from Major to Colonel), and looking for a general purpose assault rifle. Been trying out Bolter, Plasma Rifle and Laser rifle....what do you think is best?
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Hi all,
I have got 5 teams and use them equally so they are all pretty experienced and high ranked (SWO and higher). I always have 2 snipers, one uses a coin gun, the other one a sniper rifle, 2 heavy laser shooters, 2 explosive experts, one with a grenade launcher and the other one with a rocket launcher. Both also have a particle beam pistol for close combats for the Big City like missions. The last two guys have laser rifles. I can play any mission with these teams and hardly ever loose a soldier. I like the grenade launcher with the plasma grenades, its a very effective weapon and a grenade launcher soldier is always the highest ranked officer with more kills than missions..
I play a 2.3.1 release on linux. Could anyone tell me please if there are the particle beam rifles and cannons in the game? I couldn't get them so far but the particle beam pistol was researched a long time ago..
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While experimenting with weapons recently, I think I found one, quite weird effect. Some weapons have burst mode where, instead of firing in sequence, all shots are fired simultaneously. This appears to significantly reduce the accuracy, it looks like there can't be even partial overlap of the projectiles, so you get a very wide spread. I wonder if it is just me, or is there really such effect...because it makes some weapons hardly usable, like bolter, plasma blaster or needler.
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While experimenting with weapons recently, I think I found one, quite weird effect. Some weapons have burst mode where, instead of firing in sequence, all shots are fired simultaneously. This appears to significantly reduce the accuracy, it looks like there can't be even partial overlap of the projectiles, so you get a very wide spread. I wonder if it is just me, or is there really such effect...because it makes some weapons hardly usable, like bolter, plasma blaster or needler.
It's just a graphical bug thing.
Put a Plasma Rifle person on full auto/burst react at long distance and you'll see them apparently fire all their shots at once. Now make the same long-distance shot manually and you'll see the same spread and inaccuracy, but it's shot after shot.
All it means really is that the coding for react burst fire might need some looking into (low priority) and that plenty of weapons are very inaccurate at long distances - which is as it should be, see the wiki for details on spread and how different weapons suffer from deviance at longer distance relative to the point of aim.
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I'm not sure about it.
I've used automatic modes on long range before with many weapons, and only few show this effect, and it happens on any range. On range of about 5 cells, my soldier can put all three rounds from plasma rifle burst into target, but always score jsut one or two hits from burst using bolter or needler. That makes those two weapons a lot worse since their performance on short to medium ranges is terrible.
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Some related discussion. (http://ufoai.ninex.info/forum/index.php?topic=4563.0)
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I'm not sure about it.
I've used automatic modes on long range before with many weapons, and only few show this effect, and it happens on any range. On range of about 5 cells, my soldier can put all three rounds from plasma rifle burst into target, but always score jsut one or two hits from burst using bolter or needler. That makes those two weapons a lot worse since their performance on short to medium ranges is terrible.
Ok, sounds like you know more than I. I have mainly only experience using the plasma rifle much.
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Just try out using bolter, needler or plasma blaster, you'll see what I mean.
Interestingly enough, it appears to affect some more weapons only in reaction fire, for example machine gun in 5-shot burst firing as RF.
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On range of about 5 cells, my soldier can put all three rounds from plasma rifle burst into target, but always score jsut one or two hits from burst using bolter or needler.
According to the weapon definition the plasma rifle has less spread than the bolter and needler, so I'd expect something like that.
That makes those two weapons a lot worse since their performance on short to medium ranges is terrible.
Well, repeat your test and put a wall between your soldier and the alien. ...
Does the result make the plasma rifle useless?
You see different weapons give different advantages. Other wise we wouldn't need this thread.
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My favorite weapon is the coilgun. I love its accuracy and the fact that it can kill an armoured Ortnok in one hit. Its only drawbacks are the size of its magazine, and the fact that said magazines only contain 2 shots. It's nice that they can be bought though, and they're cheap.
Laser rifles are nice when it comes to accuracy and volume of fire, but their lack of punch is frustrating. I have one of my bases outfitted with laser rifles.
Grenade launchers with plasma nades.
Particle rifles. The only downside is that ammunition is very hard to come by, and cannot be produced or bought.
As far as my squads go, I have 8 bases, 4 of which have active squads that go on missions (the other bases are just for manufacturing, research, and dedicated interception; their small security teams are armed with surplus plasma rifles and whatever they get from killing attacking aliens). I always have at least one sniper in my team, one dedicated medic, armed with a pistol and a medikit, one soldier armed with a machine gun, flamer, plasma blaster, or beam cannon (depending on supply and mission objectives), one grenadier (two of my bases use the G. launcher with P-nades, the other two bases use plasma riflemen armed with stun grenades and plasma hand grenades), and the rest armed with an assault weapon (depending on base doctrine, skill of soldiers, supply, and other factors).
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At least in the early- to mid-game, the setting of choice is, in a six-man team:
- three "Rambos" with a MG
- two Riflemen (as soon as I research the laser rifle), each with a Flamethrower in a backpack,
- one Grenade Launcher guy, with a Tokarev or Laser Pistol in the holster
Each soldier has a Medikit, of course.
The purpose is to eliminate most of the Scout or Fighter teams (3 to 5 aliens) in the first round. In the small maps, the GL soldier usually gets two aliens, each with a 15-TU three round burst. Then, the MG and Laser Rifle guys get the more distant ones. Generally, I found that a crouching MG-man is able to kill with a Full-auto shot even quite strong aliens at short to medium range (up to some 20 squares), because cca six hits with MG ammo kill any Taman and even a weakly-armored Ortnok. On longer ranges, a kneeling MG soldier usually gets at least two hits from the 20 Full-auto shots, even if the hit percentage shown is quite low (5-10%); this is just enough to kill a weak Taman, stronger Tamans or Ortnoks survive; but their Plasma guns are not sufficiently precise, therefore with some Medikit aid, a crouching MG soldier is usually able to win the shoot-out anyway, even without hiding. Laser rifles are nicely precise, so the two Pulse fires and one Wave is usually enough to get a kill or at least a "Mad Rage" situation.
In Harvester missions, the MG guys usually take a crouching positions with reaction fire at a safe distance (at least 15 squares) from the craft entrance; moving a soldier close and then running back behind the wing of the craft makes the aliens usually to go outside, where the MGs get them. Then, the assault guys drop their Laser Rifles, take their Flamethrower and go fry the last one or two aliens, who usually wait in the small central room of the craft, with stairs.
Especially funny are the Big City maps, where I just get the soldiers of the dropship, make them crouch in a straight line, and wait with Reaction fire on. As soon the aliens start to pop up on the top of that parking lot building, or what it is, they receive a welcome from the three MGs and the two lasers, firstly by Reaction fire and then by Full Auto and Pulse fires. Shooting upside is highly imprecise, but they die anyway; possible wounds on my side are promptly cured by the Grenadier in the role of a Medic, because the GL cannot shoot up to the top level of the building.
I do not use the Sniper rifle, because paradoxically, it´s Aimed shot is less precise than the Full Auto MG shot (of course most of the twenty bullets miss, but at least a few always hit, and that counts). All Plasma weapons and Assault/Bolter rifles are not useful due to low precision - they just cannot guarantee the result within one turn, where Laser rifles and MGs can (and Flamers/GLs too, of course). Even in close-combat role, the 14-TU, 5-bullet shot from the MG is usually quite OK, so my MG guys do not use pistols. Shotguns have neither sufficient range nor performance - at close range, GL or Flamethrower easily outperforms them in terms of damage.
Perhaps the MG/Laser combination will lose its power later, against stronger alien armours, and will need to be replaced, but the whole Plasma arsenal I invented so far seems inferior to these simpler weapons.
I play on Insane difficulty.
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I wonder why you use 6 man teams instead of full 8...8 soldiers mean more space for specializations, and more flexibility....
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I agree that having eight soldiers makes sense (more specialization, or dedicated medics, etc.), but still, I have reasons for using only six. So far, I found that I am able to beat just any alien team I encountered without much problems - even with four soldiers (give them four MGs, Medikits, have them crouch and fire a "Full-auto" on everything that moves - they will typically win).
Six is a number which can usually kill most aliens on small maps in one turn (or, allows to take on board also a Sniper or Close combat specialist, who are currently inferior in effectiveness to my heavy weapon guys, but I train them for "future purposes", when I might need these specializations for some reason).
So why not eight? Firstly, the less soldiers, the more action, shots and kills per person - therefore faster improvement of statistics. If, in future, I encounter tougher opposition, I will be able to merge these well-trained guys from both teams into one. Secondly, the less soldiers, the less burden for the player - I have quite a lot of missions, so why move on map many soldiers when I can do all the work with a few.
This is, I think, a consequence of imbalanced gameplay (I play 2.4-dev on Insane difficulty, but still). There are too many UFOs, too many missions - around forty per month - but they are too easy. I love the game, it is nicely done, but the AI is somewhat stupid (the aliens usually do not crouch, so they cannot hit effectively, they do not take cover behind walls, they do not cooperate as a group, etc.). If this cannot be improved, then it would be better at least to raise the number of aliens in missions, and lower the frequency of UFO sightings. I would prefer much less missions (it gets repetitive after some time), but much more challenging (so that I would really have to be afraid and use my soldiers to the maximum).
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Well, exp for soldiers isn't that big problem. I am running on standard diff, aliens have yet to field shevaars or particle rifles/cannons, and I already have soldier with over 90 mind in my main team. Choose the right team and they will rise quickly. Never found 8 to be too many actually, soldiers that don't have right gear for the map just tag along as fulltime medics.
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i only use machine guns and heavy lasers, the rest doesnt really work, maybe rocket launchers some times, i never use grenade launcher, it has no range and the machine gun at medium distance will massacre bunches of aliens
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Bolters save my arse from fighting inside harvesters, have a way better ammo capacity than the coilguns and they're generally lovely for close range combat.
I admit the fact that they're fucking railguns might have a slight effect on my decision.
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maybe but if you are clever you can draw out all aliens of the ship and only deal with the last 1-2 inside, positioning your marines in an exact place you will have you 50% of the time with free pot shots inside the alien ship , the other 50% you go in with heavy lasers, i personally dont like the coil gun, you cant wear 2 weapons with it, the ammo is too bulky and i like everyone with medikits and back up grenades just in case
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I don't even have to go inside with bolters.
All I have to do is place them beside the entrance, grab the ridiculously misrepresented IR goggles and then kill them dead through the floor.
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Flame thrower all the way.
Burn! Baby burn!
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Flame thrower all the way.
Burn! Baby burn!
That one surprises me. It does good damage, and you can get a few good shots from it in a turn if you don't have to move, but the range is pretty darn short.
I use two each of Grenade Launcher (PB Grenades), Rocket Launcher (HE Rocket), Machine Gun and Flamethrower. The kill counts are lowest on Flamethrower with Machine Gun a close second. When I get Plasma Blaster researched I'll probably switch out one of Machine Gun and Flamethrower for it.
Highest kill counts on Grenade Launcher, btw.
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That one surprises me. It does good damage, and you can get a few good shots from it in a turn if you don't have to move, but the range is pretty darn short.
I use two each of Grenade Launcher (PB Grenades), Rocket Launcher (HE Rocket), Machine Gun and Flamethrower. The kill counts are lowest on Flamethrower with Machine Gun a close second. When I get Plasma Blaster researched I'll probably switch out one of Machine Gun and Flamethrower for it.
Highest kill counts on Grenade Launcher, btw.
That's strange (or my case is). In my game my flamethrowers (two teams) are a bit above GLs, tied with snipers.
The beauty of flames is that anything in its range (with enough ammo and TUs to fire it) is dead. Period. Nothing survives. Especially in the early game that kind of reliability earns fans. The short range just means that it sees use in close quarters, which is where most of the action is anyway.
If it's really needed, give the guy a laser (or plasma) pistol as a secondary for the occasional long range fight with no way to close in.
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I'll admit that I'm still in the fairly early game (about 3-4 months in on hard) so I haven't reasearched a lot. But the heavy weapons seem to have it for me. I haven't actually been worried in the game so far and am starting to wonder if the whole research thing isn't a waste of time for everything but armour, craft weapons and better craft. I tend to out-sniper the enemy every battle, with just enough stuff in reserve for close-quarters if I need it.
#1 Rocket launcher. Good: Long range, good accuracy, splash damage (possible indirect kills), cheap TU cost, highish damage.
Bad: One shot, expensive ammo, civilian casualties.
I carry 5-6 of these as a main weapon in my squad with a reload in the holster. Fire, forget, drop and pull out your "actual" main weapon from your backpack. Makes you feel all evil and commie but by god does it work. 10-12 rockets flying everywhere in 2 rounds finishes almost all opposition (and sometimes a poorly informed civilian).
2: Sniper rifle. Good: Accuracy(ducked), shoot through walls, 5 round clip, alright power, can still medi-kit someone without dropping it.
Bad: high TU cost for accuracy, needs ducking, sometimes woefully inaccurate.
Sort of like my backup rocket launchers. 2 as main weapons, 1-3 in backpacks with a spare clip. Sniper team at a moments notice.
3: Machine Pistol. Good: Fits on your belt, good ammo, low TU/shots output, makes all soldiers multi-purpose/close/medic experts. Bad: crappy damage, low ranged accuracy, hopeless vs heavy armour.
It fits on your belt. What else is there to say? It also fires 8 shots for not many TU with suprising crouched accuracy. Just something to pull out and spray at whatever you want/can't hit any other way. Ultimate secondary weapon.
My other favourites are the MG and the grenade launcher. I'm actually leaning toward's the MG instead of as many snipers, the "1" shot kill of full auto is amazing, although they make my squads a little too static for my liking. I like grenade launchers (and grenades) for the very cool things you can do with them. Can't quite reach an alien? Target 2-3 Z-levels up (by holding shift and pulling back a square or two), timed burst and pretend your mini-artillery. Works more often than not....
My standard soldier (pretty much everyone) has armour+night vision, a RL or sniper equpped, medikit+rocket/magazine in holster, machine pistol+grenade on belt, and then either a sniper/MG/GL+clips+grenades in their Backpack. or just a random weapon I want to try. Nothing has ever suprised me, and my poor troops carry this enormous load without a hitch. Even the bugged "big-city" wasn't a problem with a loadout like this. Eveyone can do everything, with enough ammo to keep on going regardless. Plasma smasma :)
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Sniper rifles (even after coilguns are in) and Rocket Launchers are my favourites, but I only field one of each (two snipers max) in any team. Actually, I tell a lie. My favourite weapon is the stunrod. Every troop carries a stunrod as basic equipment, and for my close-range soldiers (read: cannon fodder) it's one of their primary armaments.
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Assault rifle.
Even when the ortnoks appears with medium armor jejejejeje. Crouching and firing in full auto, i can dispatch many aliens at decent ranges. And in CQB, full auto makes the work nicely.
In my team, i have 4 rifleman; 2 lasers and 2 assault rifle. 2 support soldiers (MG) 1 sniper (with SR) and a grenadier or another rifleman, maybe with laser rifle.
The riflemans have rocket launchers in backpack, except one with flametrower. With this combo, i have sufficient firepower for any situation
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I´m playing 2.3.1, and i haven´t seen the flashbang or smoke grenades. What about them?
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No worky, dummied out till they do.
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i used to like grenade launchers, but not so much anymore : )
and flamers no longer always kill an armored taman for 12 tu.
now my favorite weapon is the holy hand grenade of doom.
i mean the frag grenade, didn't even research plasma yet.
makes my soldiers flexible like ballerinas.
can create yaw-dropping solutions that are unique and situational, for a soldier that uses a primary firearm, without the recurring 'who has the grenade launcher?' inconvenience.
the hand grenade can free your mind from suffering.
that's all i have to say about my favorite weapon.
edit by necessity that appeared in some other thread:
it does make sense to run around the battlefield with grenade in one hand and a knife in the other hand (more kills than the snipers in the same team).
that is because when the alien walks close, the human might want to walk a few steps closer to the alien and then walk around the alien a little bit (to the side, just out of view) to avoid reaction fire while killing the alien.
and that is melee range, and the soldier might as well be using a knife.
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On the October 15th nightly:
Grenade launchers. Mediocre range, but for 15 TU you get a high probability of a kill, plus good ability to damage or even kill additional targets.
Machine gun. Huge damage output (near the top of the damage/TU ratio list) and a long effective range when crouched, plus those magical moments when the aliens decide to line up for you.
Plasma blade. Go around corners with confidence!
Coilgun. Ammo's large and expensive, but with a good sniper I find I get about the same number of kills out of the two rounds in a coil magazine as I do from the sniper rifle's 5.
Not long ago I would have said the flamethrower, but with alien armor getting heavier I'm starting to have aliens survive Infernos—the guaranteed kill (with an unobstructed shot) was the big factor making up for the tiny range, so with that going away I'm not sure about its future in my loadout. Still a favourite until Interest gets into the mid-upper 200s.
~J
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Played it through for the second time (2.4 this time).
my favorite is the Sniper. When doing those small open maps the best weapon of choice is the sniper because of the range and firepower. I mix in two grenade launchers, but I think 8 snipers is the best for killing without being killed.
(i would like a small modification since this Sniper gun is so good. regular soldiers should be poorer with this until reaching say 25+ skill. Then you have incentive to play the sniper like a sniper, and not rush people with sniperguns into UFOs. Maybe the gun could be more expensive as well?)
Just my thoughts.:)
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(i would like a small modification since this Sniper gun is so good. regular soldiers should be poorer with this until reaching say 25+ skill. Then you have incentive to play the sniper like a sniper, and not rush people with sniperguns into UFOs. Maybe the gun could be more expensive as well?)
It's been changed a decent amount. Both firemodes cost more TUs in 2.5, snap shot is much less accurate and doesn't benefit from crouch, and aimed shot is a little more accurate while standing but a little less while crouched. On the flip side, damage has been kicked up so you're no longer nearly guaranteed to need to hit the target twice.
~J
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1. Laser Rifles. I have 3 of them in my squad now - they can massacre from distance. One laser works not so good, but 3+ is a killer team. More lasers, more aliens won't even move close, they will be dead far before their plasma toys will be effective.
2. Flamers. Masters of close combat. Killing 3 aliens with one shot? Priceless. 12 TU and armored guy is mostly dead.
3. GL. If you are sneaky and creative, 3x shot can do miracles. Not to mention what GL does to multiply targets.
4. Bolter. 3x shot = dead body. Simple as that.
MG is not needed atm. Until we get 2x2 aliens, huge, bulky, armored ones using MG is like using nuke to kill a fly.
RL - meh.
Secondary, smaller weapons - I'm not using them.
And last but not least - wallhack - those thermo-vision-stuff is priceless.
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what's a bolter? do you mean the coilgun?
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(http://i.imgur.com/fOmjC.jpg)
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MG kind of sits between your assault weapons and the flamer with effective ranges in the Assault range and close range devastation like the flamer, while perhaps not as good as either in the respective role I have on a couple of occasions gone from picking off targets at mid range with the MG then on the following couple of turns found myself close range to a couple of aliens using the most appropriate full auto option (once they were in line so normal full auto, the other time a couple of squares either side of my soldier so auto sweep dispatched them nicely) to take them out in the same firing.
As I say other weapons are more effective in their specific field but the generalist nature of the MG makes it a more flexible platform.
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Depends on soldier, with one of those elites, if trained well, MG is one of most powerful weapons, capable of taking down Ortnok in medium armor in one turn over ranges longer than flamer, and even over long ranges it will chip off a decent chunk of health. And if you catch grouped Tamans over longer range...may whatever god they worship help them.
When it comes to most effective weapons in each range category, it goes like this...(Plasma blade)(flamer)(GL)(MG)(coilgun)
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Machine gun.
BUT. Plasma grenades get a special mention. There's just something oddly satisfying in tossing a plasma grenade at an alien's feet and be like "Burn, you piece of s*it alien". Plasma is like napalm on steroids. Or when you see two or more aliens close to each other, and you have your grenade launcher w/ plasma grenades in range. At times like those, just for a fleeting second, I sometimes wonder why did they even bother putting the single fire mode on the grenade launcher anyway...
I get similar delight for using plasma rifle on full auto at a close range. I consider plasma rifles merely to be superior shotguns.
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Sniper rifle.
Cheap, powerful, accurate.
You get it right away since mission one, and you get plenty of mags for sale.
Two hits are enough to kill an alien NME.
And the risk of collateral damage to civvies is rather low (accidents do happens, though).
Nice to hear it will require more TUs to operate in 2.5 - this will help balance it with other weapons.
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Only downside is that you're perfectly capable of missing your intended target and still hitting the civilian behind it.
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Sure, but civilians are so incredibly squishy that almost any weapon will kill them in one hit, so that's not really a downside for the sniper rifle so much as it is for any non-melee weapon.
~J
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Bolter Rifle. Until you've run across an enemy with a soldier out of TU and then killed it with a guy on the other side of a building through two walls, you just won't understand ;)
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It's great and all but it's getting turned into a full on sniper in 2.5.
I'll miss sending three bolts into a harvester chalk full of Ortnoks.
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It's great and all but it's getting turned into a full on sniper in 2.5.
I'll miss sending three bolts into a harvester chalk full of Ortnoks.
Haha really? I never used it when I was playing 2.4, and in 2.5 I changed it in my mod to have a three shot fire mode... Didn't realise I was actually changing it back! :P
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3 and 4 still have a three round burst and it pretty much functions as an assault rifle there.
Though, I found some fluff claiming it has a four round burst but I never saw that one happening.
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4 rounds? I wonder if that's related to an issue I noticed in 2.5... I've had numerous weapons firing more "rounds" than they're supposed to, double sniper shots for example, and the MG firing about 30-40 shots instead of 20. I have seen the Botler unload 4-5 shots in a 3-round burst but I assumed it was just a graphical glitch and may even have been something I accidentally added while modding. I'll have to try an un-modded version of the game and see whether I still get extra shots.
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In 2.4 it seemed to me like the bolter had a strange glitched interaction with throughwall—if a shot hit a wall it would stop rather than continue through, but an additional shot would be fired on the same trajectory that would pass through that wall, repeat up to the throughwall limit. I was all excited about three-round aimed shots until I realized that only one projectile could actually hit a target.
~J
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I break my eight man group into two four man squads each armed to support the squad, and if need be the other squad. The squad functions as single body, sorta like a hive mind working together as a whole. Each squad has grenade launchers, armed with plasma grenades or ic grenades. The plasma grenades are ground clearers, while the IC grenades are are little more surgical. I call it shake and bake. Then I have two plasma blasters in each squad. They have poor range, but who needs accuracy when the gun is shoved in some orifice? Then I have one plasma rifle, which gives me a little movement and I can still go full auto. Never seen full auto fail at point blank range ever.
First I take cover always. Then each man either moves or shoots, not both. Once I'm in cover I wait for them to come to me. When they get close the grenade launcher allows me break cover shoot three rounds, and take cover again (Shake and bake). Those alien that sneak up have to find me in my cover which in most cases burns Time units. Most times they don't have time to shoot, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. The biggest problem is moving my men out the line of fire while in cover. Then I use the plasma rifles to clean up. You can move a little with a plasma rifle, full auto kills, while aimed shots finish off wounded foes. Except for large battle fields were you have chase down wandering aliens this works every time.
I never make weapons, except plasma grenades for the launcher.
With this tactic newbies work as well as harden vets. I have to keep selling alien junk or my store rooms fill up.
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"What's your favorite weapon?"
2.5 -dev
1.) Machine Gun - Enhanced Ammo
2.) Assault Rifle - Enhanced Ammo
3.) Lasser Rifle
4.) Grenade luncher PB
Before Enhanced Ammo
1.) Plazma Riffle
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Plasma blaster is great for RF at close range.
But sniper rifle is my favorite. And as long as aliens will stuck i will be.
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2.5-dev: Assault rifle with EP ammo and sniper rifle with EP ammo.
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Plasma blade. Quick, deadly, close to the point of intimacy.
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Really? The assault with the plasma bullets? I tried it but it didnt Seem to be all that good.
Must ve missed their awesomeness somehow.
I do however LOVE the sniper rifle with the new ammo. Give it to an unarmored soldier; you get 2 aimed shots of pure compressed pain to fire at anything you dont like.
I still think the coil gun is not good enough to compensate the weight.
Since 2.5 i also learned to appreciate the laser rifles!
And as a classic: pb grenade launcher.
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I'd go with either PB rifle or plasma grenade/bp grenade launcher. I don't see any use for plasma ammo for assualt or machine guns. I have repeatedly tried them on both medium armored ortnoks and tamans. I find it takes 35-40+TU to kill them or I can use a pb rifle and for 15 tu either kill or severely maim them. From what I can see the plasma ammo for human weapons isn't getting any AP bonus (and is fairly useless). Would love to see them useful.
A. How to folks go about using a RPG soldier and do they use a back up weapon for when his 4/5 rockets are fired? Do folks wait to fire until targets are within 20-50 tiles or use it more like a long range sniping weapon?
B. Machine guns, such a fun weapon, so useless in my troops hands, how do YOU use them efficiently? Do you use them as a close range/last resort shotgun effect? What ways do you use them?
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I found plasma ammo fairly useful. A decently experienced soldier will severely injure even ortnok in medium armor on range roughly 10 cells or less with full auto. The 3-round burst is excellent RF tool if you can set it up properly late in game when you have no good 8 TU weapon for RF. Of course, PB weapons are better, but their ammo is limited to what you can scavenge.
RPG is mostly heavy sniper for me, generally restricted to killing aliens near walls and sometimes using the splash as indirect damage. Due to its huge and heavy ammo, I often issue spare rockets to soldiers who have some spare carry weight, so in the end I sometimes have like dozen rockets distributed throughout my squad.
Machine guns...well, they're not that bad. 5-round burst is good as heavy support for a RF soldier when in close quarters and you need to take down something in medium armor or such, and full auto is good for crawl around the corner-fire-crawl back kind of action, like in small street map for example, or long range "tagging" aliens to induce bleeding. Early on, this is IMO best way to take down some aliens at dam map.
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B. Machine guns, such a fun weapon, so useless in my troops hands, how do YOU use them efficiently? Do you use them as a close range/last resort shotgun effect? What ways do you use them?
The MG is a slow, heavy, less accurate, assault rifle when using the 5-round burst. It's unique niche is when you have a clump of three to six aliens close together, then the 25 shot full-auto mode and it's spread can turn it into a super shotgun. Unfortunately at a 25 TU cost you have issues with soldiers surviving the alien RF at less than long range.
For the dam map you want sniper rifles for range and accuracy, or grenade launchers for bounce and indirect fire. The MG isn't accurate enough for full map distance fire and sucks in alien RF at short ranges.
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I found plasma ammo fairly useful. A decently experienced soldier will severely injure even ortnok in medium armor on range roughly 10 cells or less with full auto. The 3-round burst is excellent RF tool if you can set it up properly late in game when you have no good 8 TU weapon for RF. Of course, PB weapons are better, but their ammo is limited to what you can scavenge.
Isn't it just easier to throw a plasma grenade at said alien? (is there a way to see how much hp /dmg per attack I'm doing to the alien?)
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Isn't it just easier to throw a plasma grenade at said alien? (is there a way to see how much hp /dmg per attack I'm doing to the alien?)
Obstacles can sometimes make it difficult to get a plasma grenade in the right place, and the wide splash damage means sometimes its tough to hit an alien without hitting your own team.
From a logistics side, I typically have a lot more EP ammo to spare on a soldier than plasma grenades, especially late in a battle. And in terms of production time, EP ammo pools at the end of a battle, so firing 3 shots from a magazine is often much less costly than throwing an entire plasma grenade.
Grenades are certainly an important part of any strategy as well, but I personally make excessive use of EP, straight to the end of the game (well, I'm almost there!), simply because PB ammo is not numerous enough.
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I assume the medium armor (there is no heavy right?) alien armor takes off 75% of dmg from plasma assault ammo and machine guns?
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I assume the medium armor (there is no heavy right?) alien armor takes off 75% of dmg from plasma assault ammo and machine guns?
No it doesn't. Armour doesn't work by percentages but by subtracting its protection value from the ammo's damage value. If you want to know the exact protection for any given matchup you should add the protection values for /base/ufos/armour.ufo (https://github.com/ufoai/ufoai/blob/master/base/ufos/armour.ufo) + /base/ufos/team_aliens.ufo (https://github.com/ufoai/ufoai/blob/master/base/ufos/team_aliens.ufo) and then subtract this from the weapon's damage value (EP is in weapons_plasma.ufo (https://github.com/ufoai/ufoai/blob/master/base/ufos/weapons_plasma.ufo))
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Any thought given to "guided" rpg missiles with say 30 or 50% less dmg that are available once a soldier reaches a certain level in high explosives?
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I never hit them with just one weapon. My four man squads rain fire on them. When one fails, or misses the other three don't. What we need is plasma rockets that are guided. Hit them around corners. That put the fear of god in-um. Also, if they land in Texas, can't we let native shoot them up bit.
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In 2.4
Starting:
Machine pistol
Assault rifle
Machine gun
Not for how effective they are, but for the sheer number of low damage hits they can inflict. Start with these, then move onto laser weaponry, and your whole squad will be crack shots in no time with the weapon type of choice. It should be noted that you WILL need something higher impact against medium armored foes, which brings me to my early game gratuitous armor penetration faves.
Grenade launcher ... Because boom, you're dead x3 hard to miss
And...
Electromagnetic Rifle
I saw the sniper skill and figured it was long range. I was disappointed ... Then I realized it was a medium range capable wall ripping armor shredding shotgun that helps you gain skill in the two skills eventually used for particle accelerators, all from research that is much faster than plasma rifles, and you can make the ammo.
Great to finish the job once your other guys are done distracting the armored ortok with laser pointers.
The later game guns are fun and all, but the weapon selection listed above is what carries me to that later game with great skills off minimal gun research.
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The 2.5 Dev regular pistol is my new favorite gun. I'll explain the situation that made me fall in love with this thing. Okay, so I'm on excavation, second mission of the campaign, but already familiar with this map from good ol' v2.2. My medic gets behind the pillar (the one piece of cover on the left exit from spawn). Next turn, Taman comes pretty close (one unit away from the opposite side of the pillar) with plenty of TU's for RF. So I take out flashbang, use it, then walk around the pillar. Take a shot with pistol. Hit. Take another one. Another hit. It takes 4 shots to kill the regular Taman, by which time I'm dying of laughter. The way that the soldier takes the longest time to aim that one point blank shot (considering the animation is longer than a sniper rifle shot, I have no idea why it costs only 4 TU per shot), puts down his gun, take the next snap shot, etc, without any hint of emotion or rushing just cracks me up. My thought process during this time reminds me of the Spectre monologue in SC2 ("This one has your name on it. *Bang* Okay.... this one has your name on it. *Bang*. Okay, I'm pretty sure that THIS one.... *Bang*. What the hell is your name anyway?")
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... "This one has your name on it. *Bang* Okay.... this one has your name on it. *Bang*. Okay, I'm pretty sure that THIS one.... *Bang*. What the hell is your name anyway?"
Hehe. Epic. :D
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Played with coilgun some more, and EM Rifle still is hands down better IMHO.
Killing things through walls tends to be a yes/no proposition, and yes, you kneel just inside the harvester while 1-2 guys lens out the bands, yes you can clear out the UFO with no risk, less ammo cost, and more sniper skill practice.
As for long range shots, coilgun is not accurate enough for eight shots (2 plus 3x2 for reloads) to last a long mission and far from needed in a short one. Now if not for the EM rifle, it would be that or plasma weaponry (with which I am unimpressed) for no alien materials used assault weaponry. Then I would consider it. I would also consider it if I started running into stuff that it took like 10 Bolter hits to kill.
The flavor text implies that the coilgun does not provoke reaction fire. Can anyone confirm or refute this?
Laser tag (you didn't expect that light gun to actually kill a heavily armored target, did you?) and NERF rapid fire skill practice weapons (again, machine pistols are for target practice), the more I use the EM rifle, the more I love it. That said, it is straight up FUN to emptying a machine pistol or double tapping someone with a handgun. Point blank MG full auto and air burst GL burst retain their 15% gratuity for enjoyable, well, gratuitousness.