UFO:Alien Invasion
Development => Artwork => Topic started by: RaXaR on June 21, 2007, 09:07:09 pm
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Hi Guys, I'm no good at 3D modeling but here's what I've come up with so far for the carrier. In the top view to the left of the carrier you can see a small 'spec' that's the UFO Fighter for scale comparison. I thought the carrier should be able to hold a couple of hundred ships at least. Let me know what you guys think.
Laters . :)
(http://www.meccanine.com/ufo/UFOCarrier01.jpg)
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I'm not sure about the "belly" (because its curve breaks with the overall angular design) and the "head" (because it looks far too big to be just a bridge), but those shield things to the side look nice. The "feelers" are okay too, and I like the engines. All in all, it's not a bad design at all.
A hundred ships, though? We'll not be unleashing that many UFOs on Earth at any one time during ANY stage of the campaign.
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BT had mentioned in the other thread about holding 8-12 ships. What if it was designed differently... and reasonably sized in a new way.
Instead of the idea of a 'protective carrier', why not an oversized FTL sled. The fighers/scouts would be attached in docking collars or perhaps something more flush to the ship, and the 'carrier' portion of the carrier would be rather small, and mostly just a giant engine to move these ships from point A to point B.
Something like this...
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/GUDare/CarrierIdiaj.jpg)
Yeah yeah, make fun of my drawing all you like :) I'm still trying to figure out the GIMP ... like dealing with it after putting in some text.
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BT had mentioned in the other thread about holding 8-12 ships. What if it was designed differently... and reasonably sized in a new way.
Instead of the idea of a 'protective carrier', why not an oversized FTL sled. The fighers/scouts would be attached in docking collars or perhaps something more flush to the ship, and the 'carrier' portion of the carrier would be rather small, and mostly just a giant engine to move these ships from point A to point B.
There's nothing wrong with the concept. It'd make for a boring ship, though.
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whatever our storywriters tell - i want this model - and even if we can't include it into the single player campaign because it wouldn't fit to the story, please submit it. Even if it is untextured. There are also multiplayer campaigns and a lot of other things where i would like to see some other ufos.
to sum up: looks good imo
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There's nothing wrong with the concept. It'd make for a boring ship, though.
Well, just trying to get outside the box. One of the things I remember about the old XCom games was the 'scout' was what, a 3x3 square with a seat, and the harvester was about 12x12. A 'battleship' was 4 levels, and about what, 25x25 walking boxes or so (maybe 30x30)? It's been so damned long.
Our scouts here take up a about 8x5 walking square. Increment equivalently and the the battleships will be around the size of Australia.
This ship you could reasonably have a single map for (long and narrow, I grant you). It'd be like running a gauntlet with your troops. It'd either be a cakewalk... or very, very ugly.
It could still be staged, like Winter had planned for his other carrier, with a fight in the front and then a brawl in the engine room. I just think we *might* be able to get this on a map. I'm not a big fan of multi-map fights, but hey, that was the original plan...
Trying to think between map limitations on memory usage, and what would 'look' cool. I'm sure Raxar or Sitters could come up with a really neat looking model.
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Hmm, I don't believe it'd be that narrow. This is a carrier we're talking about. Its structure must be sturdy enough to support 8-12 other UFOs while manoeuvering, and the FTL drive must really be a bulky piece of equipment (it must really warrant the carrier as opposed to outfitting any other UFO with a FTL drive). So no matter what, the ship is going to be VERY large.
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Hmm, I don't believe it'd be that narrow. This is a carrier we're talking about. Its structure must be sturdy enough to support 8-12 other UFOs while manouvering, and the FTL drive must really be a bulky piece of equipment (it must really warrant the carrier as opposed to outfitting any other UFO with a FTL drive). So no matter what, the ship is going to be VERY large.
Hm, I see your point. I was thinking that the engine wouldn't really be the 'playable' area, and that most of the ship would be hull, refueling lines, stuff like that... basically, where you *wouldn't* be having the firefight because you'd have to crawl through it. The actual 'living' quarters and whatnot would probably only be 2-3 tiles wide, and a few levels.
I would see it needing enough firmpoints to secure the ships outside, a tube moving into the 'living area' for the 6-12 beings per ship that it would require. A fighter being about two tiles across, figure the carrier would have 3 down each of the four 'sides' of the cylindar. The hull would be about 5 tiles wide, and a tile on each side for 'support equipment' and the like.
The 'living area' would be in 5 levels, 1 tile wide top and bottom, 2 tiles wide offset 2 and 4, and 3 tiles wide in middle. But because of the lengths, you'd go for about 14-15 tiles in length. That's where my 'gauntlet' thinking was coming from. At one far end would be the door to the FTL engine room, the other would incorporate the command and control facility.
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I replaced the head and the hull with less organic models. as usual I'll await feedback. If this ship is no good, then I'll use the game's already made carrier for the backdrop instead. The way I saw this is that the lower half can detach, and will contain crew quarters and aircraft hangers. The upper part houses the long term life support systems, fuel, research laboratories and Command center. once the lower half is detached the upper part can retreat to a safe distance from the battle/invasion. While the lower half which is heavily armored can breach the battle lines and deploy it's fighters.
whatever our storywriters tell - i want this model - and even if we can't include it into the single player campaign because it wouldn't fit to the story, please submit it. Even if it is untextured. There are also multiplayer campaigns and a lot of other things where i would like to see some other ufos.
to sum up: looks good imo
Thanks Mattn, I'll upload the majority of the sources (3D/2D stuff) once the GUI is ready and capable for alpha-transparency. Um, see it as a kind of 'trade' :D (which would only really benefit the UFO:AI project anyway)
(http://www.meccanine.com/ufo/UFOCarrier02.jpg)
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For my $0.02, I like the second model better. It looks more concentrated, the design is better balanced to the engines for mass distribution, and the front looks more menacing.
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Yeah, this adequately deals with the gripes I had. Really nice ship, and I'd love to have this as the carrier. Once it is textured.
Incidentally, what you decribe (detachable components, laboratories, etc) makes is sound more like a mothership than a carrier. The carrier's ONLY role is to FTL UFO's from the mothership to the combat theater and back, so that stuff will not be included in the craft's description. It could have its own wing of fighter UFOs or even attack drones or something, though. Something to provide minimal protection in space, just enough to allow it to fulfill its role as a carrier.
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Incidentally, what you decribe (detachable components, laboratories, etc) makes is sound more like a mothership than a carrier. The carrier's ONLY role is to FTL UFO's from the mothership to the combat theater and back, so that stuff will not be included in the craft's description. It could have its own wing of fighter UFOs or even attack drones or something, though. Something to provide minimal protection in space, just enough to allow it to fulfill its role as a carrier.
Cool, no detachments then .. I'll let you guys decide what (if anything) to do with it. :) Mothership ... hmm, has one been made yet? Or can I try for that as well?
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Mothership ... hmm, has one been made yet? Or can I try for that as well?
You're more than welcome to. Here's a little info:
The mothership is very, very big. About as big as a small planet. It wasn't made that big in one go, rather it expanded as it traveled through the galaxy. All the aliens live on the mothership; it has no place to call home because it *is* home.
While the mothership is mobile, it travels extremely slowly. It mainly achieves displacement by FTL jumps. So while it is mobile, it is not designed for mobility (so engines aren't featured too heavily).
At the time UFO:AI takes place, the mothership is equipped with a for-all-means-and-purposes impenetrable energy shield.
Oh by the way. About those side panels on your carrier model, I personally consider them a part of the FTL drive system (something along the lines of focusing or stabilizing the wormhole). I haven't discussed this with anyone yet (read: with Winter), so that's just an idea I'm throwing up here, nothing definitive. But perhaps you could include variants of them on the mothership.
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wait wait - the mothership should not be available as a model - but as a map
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wait wait - the mothership should not be available as a model - but as a map
would it be okay if I made a mothership that would never be used in the game at all, maybe only for a pic in the ending? ... it would effectively then be a mother-less-ship :D
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I think there are a number of places we could use the mothership model. Wikipedia, cutscene, loading screen, etc.
Obviously it wouldn't be involved in an interception.
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yes maybe - but we need it definitly as a map, too
but maybe it's a good idea to first finish the model - and then do the map
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Sorry to drop in like this
The Mothership you talk about reminded me. I have a question: There's a map on the maplist in 2.2 dev version called "colon..." its just a quite big ship on black background (space, maybe), no soldiers, aliens and not complete with doors and things in it. (Just graphics?) Anyway i think its a great design that should be used.
It makes me think of the "Battleship" in UFO: Apocalypse (mostly for its size, not that its organic), or the Battleship in UFO1.
Really looking foward to some bigger ufos attacking earth.
Suggestion: alien bases on earth could be a ship with all the aliens need to survive, that comes through the atmosphere undetected, and drills its way into the ground.
Then it should also be possible to have more than 8 soldiers on a team, especially if there's going to be an attack on the alien main base in the future
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but maybe it's a good idea to first finish the model - and then do the map
The map is the more important of the two, and I don't think it has any relation to the mothership model at all. After all, the mothership is so big it won't have any effect on the map's layout. Instead, the mothership map should just be a large alien base style map. Or possibly two maps, if we choose to make the final mission a multi-stage mission.
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Alright guys, I need to know if this model is now approved or rejected. I'm waiting for this decision so I can know which carrier model is going onto the Backdrop of the Main Menu.
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Well, if it were up to me I'd say go for it, but I'll have to convince Winter first. However, since we'll be wanting this model in our repo anyway, can you try texturing it in the mean time?
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I really hope Winter does, I think I can make a schematic of the inside of the carrier to assert it's plausibility.
EDIT: I'll fiddle with texturing/shading it a bit .. but I'm really too impatient and too crap at texturing hehe
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If you can't/don't want to do the texturing, can you make the model available so others may take a stab at it?
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If you can't/don't want to do the texturing, can you make the model available so others may take a stab at it?
Yeah sure, won't be a problem .. but like I said to Mattn, When the GUI is capable, the sources of all this, and more to come, will be available ;)
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wait wait - the mothership should not be available as a model - but as a map
It would be handy to have a mothership model, though, even if only for cinematics and backgrounds.
I very much like the model you made, RaXaR, and it should definitely be in the game somehow, but personally I don't see it as the Carrier . . . We could probably fit it as a different capital ship -- maybe orbital battleships or mothership escorts?
I'd be fine with anyone making adjustments to my current Carrier model (and texture) to bring it further in line with the rest of the UFO art, and to better highlight the FTL drive. I simply think it's the best base to work from to give us a plausible and good-looking orbital platform.
Regards,
Winter
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Woohooo!! :D You just made my week Winter! Thx man! :) ...RaXaR goes into design berserker mode....
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I spent most of my Sunday texturing this thing, but as I said before, I suck at it :) I ended up deleting all the texturing and just making the damn thing plain :D
So if there is someone out there that can texture, Pleeeeaaasssee drop a message here or send someone a PM.
These's are renders for the higher resolution version. There is two files of this model. One for Mid- and one for a Higher poly-count. The higher resolution one comes in at about 75 000 polys.
I designed it as a 'Utility vessel', I stuck with the name Carrier for the time being, didn't really know what else to call it.
I've included a description for the Pod at bottom of the ship. I kept the design 'squarish' to facilitate the possibility of being used in a map somewhere.
Hope you guys like it, as for me, I'm getting back to the Mothership.
(http://www.meccanine.com/ufo/Carrier/UFO_Carrier_Angle01.jpg)
(http://www.meccanine.com/ufo/Carrier/UFO_Carrier_Angle02.jpg)
(http://www.meccanine.com/ufo/Carrier/CarrierPod-Explanation.jpg)
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I spent most of my Sunday texturing this thing, but as I said before, I suck at it :) I ended up deleting all the texturing and just making the damn thing plain :D
So if there is someone out there that can texture, Pleeeeaaasssee drop a message here or send someone a PM.
These's are renders for the higher resolution version. There is two files of this model. One for Mid- and one for a Higher poly-count. The higher resolution one comes in at about 75 000 polys.
Very nice design, I will texture it for you, if you have the .obj or .3ds files.
They have already UV maps ?
Willem
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Coolness Sitters :)
I'll post a link to the stuff once the Project Crew gives me a spot to upload to.
Unfortunately, the model is very badly Unwrapped. It was a sort of, unwrap-as-you-go thing, but when I saw how bad my texturing is turning out, I ditched the whole idea. Mind you, there is some default mapping on some of the primitives. The mid-poly version I didn't unwrap at all.
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As promised, here's the sources. There are .OBJ, .3DS and .MAX files of each version. If you have any serious problems with it then let me know. Also, thanks Mattn for providing the upload spot ;)
UFO Carrier Full (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Full.zip) (2.71MB)
UFO Carrier Mid (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Mid.zip) (900KB)
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As promised, here's the sources. There are .OBJ, .3DS and .MAX files of each version. If you have any serious problems with it then let me know. Also, thanks Mattn for providing the upload spot ;)
UFO Carrier Full (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Full.zip) (2.71MB)
UFO Carrier Mid (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Mid.zip) (900KB)
OK I've got it.
The problem is there are a lot of object copy's without an UV-map, What I also do when I use object copies, first make an UV map and then copy the object.
then the copy's have the same UV map, material and texture.
I disassemble the mid_carrier, remove the copy's, make UV maps and texture the stuff, and then copy and reassemble the carrier again.
I think the mid_craft is going to be two or three MD2 models.
The big one is an bigger problem, here we have an very big amount of object copy's. for making this textured is almost rebuilding the complete craft, and an lot of work and maybe never used by the game.
Always when you make an model with object copy's that are looking the same, make first an UV map and material. then all the copy objects have the same material an texture, then you only have to texture one object and the copy's have automatic the same texture.
One thing to remember when you use texture baking the copy objects are also the same.
But it is just an tip. :)
Willem
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aren't there instances - i mean max can create instances of an object - changing on, changes the other, too
but for this kind of model it''s also good to just use a flipping plane imo
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Sweet Sitters, Thanks for the tip ;)
I don't think the Model is going to be used in the game (during missions etc) at all. I think for now the only one that needs texturing is the Higher-Res one, because that is going on a couple of screens ingame and maybe in some cinematics.
I'll reconstruct the ship, if you can supply me with one of each part that is already UV mapped, then I'll copy and layout the entire ship again.? Let me know what you think.
Also, for now until Winter/Mattn/Someone says other wise, I think you can skip the Mid Poly Model and a MD2 format.
Laters :)
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hm. well i don't know for sure - Winter: are we going to display the model in an ufopedia news entry?
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aren't there instances - i mean max can create instances of an object - changing on, changes the other, too
but for this kind of model it''s also good to just use a flipping plane imo
Yip, I did use instances, but I think Sitters is using the 3DS or OBJ file which destroys the instances and makes copies of each one :?
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aren't there instances - i mean max can create instances of an object - changing on, changes the other, too
but for this kind of model it''s also good to just use a flipping plane imo
Yip, I did use instances, but I think Sitters is using the 3DS or OBJ file which destroys the instances and makes copies of each one :?
Yea I work with cinema4D, and cant read .max files.
So I use .obj or .3ds and now I have an million objects. :shock:
Willem
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hm. well i don't know for sure - Winter: are we going to display the model in an ufopedia news entry?
If we're just using it as a mothership escort, probably not. If we're going to have it attacking Earth in-game, then yes, we should have a research topic for it. I'll have a talk with BTAxis and then we can make the decision.
Personally, I think it would be fun to have a big ship nastier than the Carrier (possibly with its own protective fleet of UFOs on board) that appears later on, to make the player go "Oh, shit!" whenever one shows up.
BTAxis might not agree with me on that, but I think we can work out a satisfactory compromise.
Regards,
Winter
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Yea I work with cinema4D, and cant read .max files.
So I use .obj or .3ds and now I have an million objects.
I have to agree sitters, that is a terrible thing to try and texture .. I'll make another package that only contains 1 of each component used to build the ship .. If you would be so kind to texture those, then I can use them to reconstruct the entire ship instead.
That way we retain the 'UV Map one for many uses' scenario. :) .. I'll post the package in a while. I hope this is okay?
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Alright, I left only the bare minimum of parts that needs texturing. Feel free to add extra parts you would like to see on the model. Hope this is okay.
UFO Carrier Components (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Components.zip) (421KB)
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Alright, I left only the bare minimum of parts that needs texturing. Feel free to add extra parts you would like to see on the model. Hope this is okay.
UFO Carrier Components (http://mattn.ninex.info/files/raxar/UFO_Carrier_Components.zip) (421KB)
Yea this is OK . :D
Willem