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Author Topic: Hyperion  (Read 52423 times)

Offline BTAxis

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #75 on: December 25, 2008, 07:00:48 pm »
It looks interesting, but I think it's too big. Remember that the Raptor must be able to fit on the dropship tile, same as the other dropships, and it needs to cast a shadow too. While we could expand the dropship tile if absolutely necessary, we'd have to adjust a lot of maps for that, so I'd like to attempt fitting the Raptor on the current tile first. Remember, the current tile is 24x16 humans big (512 x 768 map units, that's 16384 by 24576 meters for you). You have as much space in the z direction as you want, though.

I like the idea of the Raptor not having wings, so hold that thought. Furthermore, it should be a single craft (no separating pods) that holds 10 humans and 1 UGV. The Raptor doubles as an interceptor, so it's armed.

It may be a tough job. Please just try to get a shape that fits the description above, and try not to splurge in the X and Y directions (but use as much space as you think you have to in order to make it look good). If it turns out it's still too big after that, we'll just adjust the maps to fit it, I guess.
« Last Edit: December 25, 2008, 07:07:42 pm by BTAxis »

Offline Winter

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #76 on: December 25, 2008, 10:05:53 pm »
Other aircraft

Just an aircraft that can fly pure on engine power ( 5 antimatter engines ), so don't have wings.
It also have a small pod that can be dropped from the middle.

There is no description for the raptor so I make some models.
If you like some changes, like to hear it.
If you don't like it at all, it go's to the trashcan.



Willem

I'll be honest, I'm not too keen on this one. The shape just seems like random bits of geometry rather than a functioning air- or space-craft.

Lack of wings is good -- the Raptor is supposed to be nearly space-capable. One idea is to simply mount large, rotatable engine pods on the sides in the middle of the craft rather than putting engines in the back. The pods could have multiple antimatter engines per pod, 2 or even 3 in one rotatable aerodynamic housing.

Is that anything you can work with, sitters, or do you need more info? Thanks!

Regards,
Winter

Offline DuKe2112

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #77 on: December 26, 2008, 12:20:22 am »
Hmm you can be space capable while having wings, too (; (like the Stingray)

I made a little concept earlier today, I wanted it to resemple it's name, like the Dragon and Stingray.
So It's a sleek design with a big hardpoint under the nose (the 'mouth') and two on the bottom fins, which are suppose to be stabilisers as well as the landing gear (the 'claws on the feet')
And for a change it doesn't have doors, but instead lowers the entire cargo bay.
I also gave it a full wing body to resemble the stingray. Oh and foldable wings to fit it's space.
The mini engines on the front are for vtol.

Hope it gives you and idea.


[attachment deleted by admin]
« Last Edit: December 26, 2008, 12:23:17 am by DuKe2112 »

Offline Chriswriter90

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #78 on: December 26, 2008, 03:16:31 am »
Currently, I like DuKe's model better. It just seems right for some reason.

Offline sitters

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #79 on: December 26, 2008, 08:27:54 am »
Hmm you can be space capable while having wings, too (; (like the Stingray)

I made a little concept earlier today, I wanted it to resemple it's name, like the Dragon and Stingray.
So It's a sleek design with a big hardpoint under the nose (the 'mouth') and two on the bottom fins, which are suppose to be stabilisers as well as the landing gear (the 'claws on the feet')
And for a change it doesn't have doors, but instead lowers the entire cargo bay.
I also gave it a full wing body to resemble the stingray. Oh and foldable wings to fit it's space.
The mini engines on the front are for vtol.

Hope it gives you and idea.



Yea , I also like this very much.

I make an model of this one, then we see if it fits in.
if not, i change it or make an other.

Willem



Offline Winter

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #80 on: December 26, 2008, 10:23:07 am »
Hmm you can be space capable while having wings, too (; (like the Stingray)

I made a little concept earlier today, I wanted it to resemple it's name, like the Dragon and Stingray.
So It's a sleek design with a big hardpoint under the nose (the 'mouth') and two on the bottom fins, which are suppose to be stabilisers as well as the landing gear (the 'claws on the feet')
And for a change it doesn't have doors, but instead lowers the entire cargo bay.
I also gave it a full wing body to resemble the stingray. Oh and foldable wings to fit it's space.
The mini engines on the front are for vtol.

Hope it gives you and idea.


It's not a bad design but I do have one major quibble: the bendy neck is a bad idea. It puts unnecessary stresses on the airframe and builds weaknesses into it. I reckon it'll actually look more solid, less strange and Firefly-like that way.

Regards,
Winter

Offline Psawhn

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #81 on: December 27, 2008, 05:06:51 am »
Funnily enough, I was toying with a similar design to that - sort of Firefly-esque, but smaller, and also with a more curved and organic body like the Stingray.

Sitters' other antimatter-powered aircraft, the Dragon and Starchaser, have both had more angular bodies than the Stingray. I think a rounded body for the Raptor would work very well and help it feel like it and the Stingray share development and represent the epitome of Phalanx' research into UFO technologies. I think that also calls for alien-material blue in the textures, as well as those depressions/extrusions and green glowies.\

I do have some additional irks with the design, in addition to what Winter says. (Of course, I hasten to add, he's the art lead and not me. ;) )\
Having the entire cargo area drop down has a number of disadvantages for a combat transport. Engineering-wise, it puts a considerable amount of complexity into the design. The hoisting mechanism, whether it be fluid or electrically powered, concentrates a lot of the stresses into a few vulnerable points. In addition to the extra fragility, it adds weight, and while extra mass is fatal for any spacecraft, it is ironically an even stronger concern for human-built antimatter powered spacecraft. Extra weight translates to an increase in fuel consumption, and antimatter is too valuable to waste needlessly.

There are a few combat-related reasons why an elevating platform is a poorer choice than simple doors or ramps. It takes longer to deploy and retract than a simple door. It physically moves the entire squad, potentially causing disorientation in the vital time of deployment to a hostile LZ. It also provides much less cover - the only cover is the two fins to the side, leaving the entire squad vulnerable to fire. Not only that, but it exposes the lower parts of their bodies first, and only when the entire soldier is exposed to fire does he get a chance to see the battlefield. He must also wait for the platform to be lowered far enough that he can jump out, because the craft can not fly with the cargo bay open lest the winds sweep across the entire crew, and the stresses of maneuvering will be focused on the hinges and supports.


Of course, that's nitpicking at this stage - the general shape and ideas of the ship I like very much. I'm just, well, nitpicky. :) A lowering platform is a cool idea, but I don't think it's practical in the least for a combat transport. (Things become a different matter if it's more of a civilian or tactical transport - in that case, the loading advantages of a lowering platform outweigh the disadvantages I've given above.)

Offline sitters

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #82 on: December 27, 2008, 08:43:35 am »

OK, an other shape, it's just a basic shape, no weapons and other attributes.
I make them when the basic shape is OK.




Willem

Offline Winter

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #83 on: December 27, 2008, 12:02:18 pm »
Two suggestions:

1. Lose the little wings at the back, or at least angle them downwards so they're not in the way of the antimatter exhaust.

2. Widen the front to give a better impression of cargo space.

Thanks!

Regards,
Winter

Offline BTAxis

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #84 on: December 27, 2008, 01:40:24 pm »
It looks too human to my taste - any chance of making it a little more UFO-like?

Offline DuKe2112

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #85 on: December 27, 2008, 04:15:48 pm »
hmm, i think a lot of the alien feel comes out of the texture, although a kinf of fluent shape is probably helpfull.

And Psawhn it's nice to know there is someone as nitpicky as I am (;
I took the elevator, because the ugv pods use them, too. I actually had a ramp and the ele only for the internal ugv, but then I thought this was more practical.
Well an ambush could be avoided by a simple plate around as cover and it could also be dropped during vtol. But as you said moot point.

I don't get your firefly reference though, I'm pretty sure you two don't mean the bug and I had the profile of a raptor in mind.
I also figured the alien materials won't care much about the stress.

Offline sitters

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #86 on: December 27, 2008, 05:26:59 pm »

OK, back wings removed and more alien



willem

Offline Winter

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #87 on: December 27, 2008, 05:47:40 pm »
I don't get your firefly reference though, I'm pretty sure you two don't mean the bug and I had the profile of a raptor in mind.

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/serenity-7.jpg

THAT's a Firefly.

I actually quite like this shape for the Raptor, it feels like sort of a cross between the more human ships and the Stingray. Great work, sitters! Only one tiny request this time -- could you shorten the ship slightly between the engine pods and the back of the wings? I think that'll help it look a little bit more balanced.

When that's done I reckon we can move on to the texturing phase.

Regards,
Winter

Offline sitters

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #88 on: December 27, 2008, 08:22:34 pm »

yea the balance is better this way.

I UV and textured it.




Willem

Offline BTAxis

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Re: Hyperion
« Reply #89 on: December 27, 2008, 08:24:28 pm »
How big is it compared to the Herakles caryall?