Grenades

[Takai]

I noticed people say grenades are over-powered. I think it's because they don't need to be primed anymore, which I think is a mistake. A grenade should be first prepared for throw, so one soldier (or alien) won't throw multiple grenades in one turn.

Also, are Alien Grenades now "plasma grenades"? Alien Grenade is a cool name.

[BTAxis]

I'd like primed grenades, but I don't think they'll happen, at least not anytime soon.

[Takai]

I'd like primed grenades, but I don't think they'll happen, at least not anytime soon.

Is it hard to implement?

[BTAxis]

Probably not. But they'd be a departure from what we have. Things like 3-round airburst fire on the grenade launcher wouldn't make sense anymore.

[Takai]

Probably not. But they'd be a departure from what we have. Things like 3-round airburst fire on the grenade launcher wouldn't make sense anymore.

Why?

[BTAxis]

Because they explode on impact right now. If you primed them they would lie around until the end of the turn (or something), so it'd not be airburst anymore.

[Takai]

No, I meant spending APs to make grenade live (explode after being thrown). Pull out the pull-ring (push the button, whatever) - throw - BOOM.

Shouldn't grenade laucher use its own type of munition anyway?

[BTAxis]

So basically all you want is increase the TU cost to throw a grenade. That can be done, but that's just balancing. I don't see the need to make an elaborate extra step to first prime the grenade and then throw it when you can do it in a single action.

The grenade launcher does use its own ammo, but the principle is the same (an explosive, non-propelled weapon).

[Takai]

I saw it this way: a primed grenade can be held in hand indefinetely before being thrown (but putting it back on the belt is a bad idea ). A non-readied grenade can be thrown to the other soldier. (Honestly, I never ever primed the X-COM grenades other than 0.)

Do you have one- and two-handed weapons, and an option to wield tow light weapons at once? Because it would add another reason to use sidearms (like a pistol and a grenade, both ready to use without penalties).

Do you have high explosives to be set for demolishion? Do you have a physics system making buildings collapse after being damaged?

[BTAxis]

Do you have high explosives to be set for demolishion? Do you have a physics system making buildings collapse after being damaged?

No, we have none of this. The Quake 2 engine is not suitable for it.

[Takai]

No, we have none of this. The Quake 2 engine is not suitable for it.

No scenery damage at all?

[BTAxis]

No, there is some. Breaking windows, a part of a wall here and there. But most of it is static. You can't destroy even a Japanese paper wall with an RPG.

This is probably the most requested feature of all. But the truth of the matter is, it's not doable, not on this engine.

[TroubleMaker]

I'll agree with Takai (funny name, wasn't it taken from Harry Harryson SGF novels about Steel Rat's adventures?): the grenade's throwing must be two-stepped: prime step and the throw itself.

In real world the soldier holding a primed grenade may be killed, wounded or just can stumble upon something, and his movement may cause the explosion "in-place" and the soldier's environment, i.e. his team members, may be destroyed/damaged.

Well, I see no need in "priming timer" - standard grenade (at least Russian RGD-5 hand grenade) trigger gives us about 5 seconds before the blast. And the grenade may even explode during its flight, if thrown properly. (very risky usage. I have some training on that, but I'll never try to do that - I'll not to lose my fingers or something more vital)

Priming of launcher's grenades is absolutely useless.

[Mattn]

i totally disagree with two steps grenades - at least in actions. we can balance this via TUs (as BTAxis said) - not not with two actions to throw a grenade. There will maybe later be an option to arm a grenade and let it explode when you are shoot down.

[Winter]

The point of priming grenades in X-COM was to let the player decide how many turns it would take before the grenade went off. We've written this feature into the weapons writeups from the start, and I think we should have it in the game.

The point is, how? Doing it with tons of different firedefs would in my opinion be so ugly as to be unworkable. Two-step grenades may very well be the only elegant way to handle it.

Regards,
Winter